Cheryl Mead, building biologist, joined us 24th September 2020 to discuss the science and art of creating a ​healthy home and work environment. In her live interview with Molly Knight she covered:

  • mould/biotoxins in water-damaged buildings, including the biological effects of living or working in a water-damaged building 
  • how to identify if your home or work place is making you sick



Cheryl is a qualified Building Biologist, Environmental Health Consultant and Electromagnetic Frequency and Radiation (EMF/EMR) Specialist with a passion for sustainable design, health and wellness and ethical business. After many years working in the building industry,​ Cheryl made it her mission to understand why we haven’t reduced the incidence of cancer and why more businesses fail than succeed. After spending bucket loads on business training, and investigating the cause of illness she ventured into the world of environmental science at the Australian College of Environmental Studies.

Click on the image below to watch the full interview:


The full transcript follows – E&OE :


Molly Knight 0:00
Good evening, everyone. Welcome to Health Australia Party Thursday night, little chit chats. Tonight, we’re talking with Cheryl Mead. And Cheryl is a building biologist. She’s a mother and a grandmother. And she studied building biology at the College of environmental studies in Melbourne. And she has an awful lot to tell us so much that we’re going to have to put it into two talks. So tonight, we’re going to talk about building biology and the science and history behind it. And next Tuesday night, please join us because we’re going to be talking about pregnancy, the fetus, babies, children, and the effects of molds, and environmental toxins, and that will move into electromagnetic frequencies and so on everything that will affect the body, particularly molds. And tonight, we’re talking about building biology, what it is what it means, and how do you know if you’re actually living in a toxic home, because you can’t always see the molds. And a lot of people don’t smell these things. So Cheryl, welcome. Thank you so much for joining us tonight.

Cheryl Mead 1:22
Thank you, it’s great to be here. I’m really enjoying the conversation that we’ve had, but also to let people know a little bit more about doing biology and why it’s actually very special. And I actually believe it’s going to be even more beneficial for the future. Because we will, we will need to make some changes in the way we live if we want to live healthier for long.

Molly Knight 1:51
Yes, I agree. And I think I was thinking about building biology. And to me, it’s a new science, because certainly growing up, I’d never heard of it. And even into my 30s and 40s and 50s. It was something that wasn’t on the radar. So it’s interesting that it’s such an important issue now. Maybe it’s because we’re becoming more aware of molds and how the environment is affecting people’s health. Yeah,

Cheryl Mead 2:19
so mold is just one subject that that we study, because it is it’s a fairly big subject, actually, because mold these days, people might not be aware of it. But there was a Dr. Tim Moore from Tasmania did a scoping study on moisture in buildings. And in Tasmania, for instance, where he, he studied, which was from the university there, they discovered that, that 40% of new builds within six to seven years were water damage causing mold. And it’s to do with the way that they build houses these days, which they wrap them up in to be airtight and use a lot of plastics, which is really what petrochemical paints are, and they sweet, so they actually cause water within the building envelope. And that water turns into, or moisture condensates turns into moisture inside the building and causing mold. And it turns out that 30% of buildings throughout Australia are water damaged in some way. So it’s a it’s a really big subject. And then when you tie into that the fact that 24% of the people or the population do not produce antibodies to mold, which means their immune system doesn’t fight off the toxin. And they get really sick when they’re exposed to a water damage building. So

Molly Knight 3:54
that’s huge. That’s a quarter of the population.

Cheryl Mead 3:57
Yes, potentially. But if they’re exposed to it for anything, or if a building, for instance, is exposed to moisture for 48 hours or more. It’s enough for mold to grow. And so there’s lots of reasons we’ll touch on those later. But that’s just one of the subjects that we study in doing biology. And it’s originated in, in Germany, back in the 70s. And that was after the homes that they constructed were built really rapidly due to the increase in population and building materials changed. So what happened was people were becoming sick, and they didn’t know why. And it was discovered that the buildings were actually making them sick. And that’s where sick building syndrome came. So the history of boom biology from that point in time then spread around the world. And so there are a lot of other institutions like in America that that teach it That’s actually where Nicole the head of the college here in Melbourne. That’s where she studied. And she brought it to Australia. And the Australian College of environmental studies, is a registered training organisation. And it’s the only education facility that actually teaches building biology. I’m also a member of the Australasian society of Building Biologists, which is graduates from the College, we actually do spend a bit of time educating the public about what we do. So I’ve been a member there since 2016. And that’s also one way that you can actually find a little bit more about biology if you want to go searching.

Molly Knight 5:46
Hmm, is certainly an interesting field. So mold is one part what what are the other areas or water damaged buildings? Yeah, yes.

Cheryl Mead 5:56
So we actually do, we do study air pollution, water pollution, electronic or electricity, and electro biology. Now, electro biology, once you study electricity, which is obviously everything to do with the wiring in the house of appliances, and radiofrequency radiation or wireless technology, you then we then study the effects of that on the body on the body, which is what God, which is what electro biology is. There are some other electives, which is we study building materials, but I’ve studied building design, as well as geology, which is earth energy. And there’s a few other things we do is study children’s health. And there’s another subject, which is really relevant, which is research methods, which means that when we look at everything we do, it’s all backed up by science, that science base. But we we research, the research to make sure that it’s not industry funded. And what that means is that industry funded research will be biased toward the industry. We always we focus on health. So we always look for the research that will back up the health effects. And and what the influences for us radio frequencies. There’s a lot of research that says that there’s no effect on the body, which is from will use like wireless technology. by natural factor is, and people will say that there’s no evidence, but there actually is this battle modes of evidence. initiative report is a good example of that, which was provided in 2012. Available online, but it’s Yeah.

Molly Knight 7:47
Well, people don’t know to look for this information. Do they know That’s right.

Cheryl Mead 7:53
So the subject, actually, it from, from its original reason for Bain was to be able to design and build environmentally friendly, so non toxic homes that were also ecologically friendly. So a low environmental footprint. So we use products that have low embodied energy, which means that the energy that goes into the product is is better for our environment. We also look at more steady passive design, so the orientation of the home as well as all the components that go in the home. So when you’re looking at materials, you’re looking at them for a whole heap of reasons why they good for you, or good for the environment, and longevity so that they can be recycled, that type of thing. So that’s a really, very extensive area of study and research. Hmm. So then, if you have the the there is a handout or information available for people that are interested, I put together so then that that shows you that we actually follow 25 guiding principles which relate to the built environment. And they’re the things that we focus on. And it starts with design that it’s really based on fresh air is this obviously recycled air and to reduce as many allergens and toxins, including mold. The bite that we build is that we actually know how to actually build to ensure that the home isn’t affected by moisture, which is pretty high.

Molly Knight 9:45
Yeah, that’s very important. So you’re talking about doing a build from scratch. Like it’s starting to build a house? Yeah, okay.

Cheryl Mead 9:53
Yeah. But you can actually do things with existing home to make it better. If we bought on has Water Damage or moisture penetration from home habit reasons, then there will be some things that we suggest they do to eliminate moisture within the home. Some of it can be just habits like creating better habits, some of it is better appliances or equipment that will actually reduce moisture in the air. Because we take humidity readings, which pretty much give us an indication of how much moisture is held in the air, or the reading is actually also given for specific humidity rating. Because the hotter the air, the moment the air, the more moisture it holds. So cold rooms, for instance, whites support moisture in the air and so moisture settles at dew point it creates condensation on the walls of windows or surfaces. And that’s where a lot of the moisture will come from, especially in Tasmania, where it’s cold, but you can have an effect on the actual building itself. The thing that’s probably really interesting about it is that the products will actually also absorb and release moisture. So timber for example. That’s why they use cedar in spots, because the timber is when the humidity increases, the timber absorbs the moisture and then when it’s not humidity, it releases it. So you can actually create a home, that’s hard to scrubbing. That’s the term used for the materials that absorb and release moisture. But if you have all your walls painted in, in polyurethane, which is a plastic, it doesn’t allow that. So timber is the preferred material, that knowledge is stored on all that work for that reason. It’s also the lowest has the lowest environmental footprint, and it’s recyclable. and sustainable. It’s it’s brilliant.

Molly Knight 12:02
It’s a good choice, it would be fair to say I guess, as I drive through the the new suburbs that we’re living in, and there’s mushrooms of houses popping up everywhere, it’d be pretty fair to say that none of these would be built within many of these features in my door, is there a standard that builders must adhere to in terms of moisture protection in homes now, if there’s 40% of buildings that are affected by water?

Cheryl Mead 12:32
Well, if it follows the heat the building code, you should be able to build a healthy home and there are some simple bills out there to do to do a good job. So not all builders are bad. But a lot of the building is is cost happy, but LastPass wins. Let’s see. And so people will remove some things to make it cheaper, or they will just use cheapest products. Or a good example is if you’re going to put a ventilation system in above your rangehood or in your bathroom. You know when you turn your your share on you’re going to create moisture, a lot of the ducting will just go straight into the roof cavity and not outside. So it’s just a really good idea to actually put the ductwork outside, in this fader underneath, underneath it so that the moisture gets transferred outside not into the roof space because that causes condensation. And and then if you’re if you’re actually looking at some of the other things in like just making sure that you’ve got really good cross flow ventilation to air it out because that makes makes the house is braids really better. So there’s lots of there’s lots of things I mean, we we have a whole list of things that we we study in relation to producing a healthy home. I mean, they’re just some of them.

Molly Knight 13:59
It’s very interesting, isn’t it? Things have done I certainly wouldn’t necessarily think about in the home. So if you have an existing home and your shower fan in the shower, I’m sure that probably just goes straight into the roof. So is there a way that can be fixed so that you can duct it out?

Cheryl Mead 14:19
Yeah, I do. It’s really all you need to do is extend that that word out to the into the building and then outside. You can you can actually put Rufus in. But I’m a great believer in the less penetrations in the roof, the better they are all sources of moisture, should they fail. So decking out underneath us is the preferred option and having eaves is even more important because that keeps him wearing a hat, just the water off the building. So they’re just and that’s a design thing. You know, you design your house really well. The other thing If you haven’t got the ability to do that, you can actually install dehumidifiers. So dehumidifiers will take the moisture out of the air. And often they’re set at a certain rate. So what do you mean when we work on 45 to 55 for relative humidity, so that’s moisture in the air, it can be a little bit above that. You don’t want to be too low. Because if you take too much moisture out of the air, you end up taking moisture out of your body. So it’ll suck if you leave them going in. So long term it suck the moisture out of you. Yes, and they’ll actually take the moisture out of everything, like furnishings and things so that normally, timber has a certain moisture content, it’s only when it gets too much moisture that you get mold. And there are some things in relation to which we’ll get onto when we talk about Mom, where there’s a certain natural environment that is beneficial. And that’s what we aim for. That’s what the ology standards are based on.

Molly Knight 16:07
Okay. Okay. And what about I mean, obviously, in winter, there’s a lot more condensation on the windows, isn’t it? And that could be obviously a bit of a problem, because it’s moisture in the house inside the house.

Cheryl Mead 16:20
Yeah. Well, we are actually moisture. So when we breathe, we emit moisture. So the more people in the house, the more moisture. And that’s the whole reason, everything is because you’re sharing your washing law, you’re cooking. So there’s lots of ways that you build up moisture inside a home, and you feel not airing it out by typing the windows up, and you have no way of getting the moisture out. If your ducting isn’t working properly, then that can be a source of potential moisture causing mold. Because when there’s motion, there’s mold.

Molly Knight 16:58
Okay, so even if you’re not seeing deposits of mold growing, it’s still a, it could be there. Could be Yeah,


Cheryl Mead 17:08
Okay. So one of the things that people don’t recognize from pitch, you might not say it, when when showers are built there, they have what’s called a waterproof membrane, the, the membrane actually stops the water from penetrating the wall. And so you put a waterproof membrane in a building. And when, when you put tiles on top of that, you actually put down what’s called wet area board. And that’s. So that’s where all bathrooms, that’s building code standard, but it is a, this is a book produced by the Master Builders in New South Wales. Yeah. So that’s actually got some new Yeah, actually good information in it, to make sure that builders or the people that do the wide area waterproofing do a really good job. Because that’s they’re known to fail. So what happens is that as soon as you get a breach or a break in that waterproof membrane, moisture gets into the walls, and that’s often in older buildings, where you’ll get mold from, and you won’t necessarily say it, but it will be sick behind the wall, or it could be underneath the floor. I’ve seen lots of places where the bathrooms actually have water coming out of the shower basis and then running into the often the master bedroom and the carpets get with and that’s where you will get mold. So there’s some of the examples of moisture in a house. If you if you do get moisture in the house are there is people there are people qualified to actually do remediation work, or the standards to a to follow. And they’re from based out of America, because we don’t have standards here in Australia, but but in the US, they have pretty much standards for everything. And the standards actually come in a book. So the iicrc actually accredited, accredited people worldwide to be able to do remediation. So this is just a really good thing to know about. And because a lot of people want to actually get rid of the problem, so molds a little bit like asbestos, it’s extremely small, sort of microscopic, in size. So when you are dealing with mold in a building, it’s not always obvious to you. But I’ll just explain this before I go on to any other stuff when when you have mold in say a bathroom. You might see it live in a mold on the surface which you can come in But it’s what’s behind the wall or underneath the floor, that causes the real problem. And they it’s a term mold is actually a family. So it grows, the family grows. And it’s like that it’s a living thing. And that happened the hi fi, which is the spores they break off and they infiltrate the air that’s small that you can’t see them. They’re been fed between three to four micron. And so micron is a millionth of a meter. You can fit something like 100 mold spores on the pinhead.

Molly Knight 20:37
Gosh, yeah.

Cheryl Mead 20:39
Yeah. So you can detect them in a house, if you actually seem to have this black stuff sitting on your windowsills, or around the edges of your exhaust fan, or places where you don’t get to claim them. It’s often multiples.

Molly Knight 20:57
Okay, so you think it’s dust, but it could be?

Cheryl Mead 21:00
Oh, well, dust. And if you’ve got dust on surfaces, and then you have moisture on it, the mold will grow on the dust. So mold only grows on fibrous material. But if you’ve got a concrete with dust on it, it’ll grow on the mold on concrete, not on not actually on the concrete, it won’t grow in class, they will grow on the dust that accumulates at the bottom of the glass. And so it like mold pretty much grows on any anything that’s fibrous as long as the loss

Molly Knight 21:32
and moisture model grow. Okay, I’m sure we’ve had a question from Helena. She says if there was mold in a wall cavity, and the natural mold killer was sprayed inside the cavity. And the cutouts of gyprock were put back sealed. But now almost two years later, water damage is evident again, on swelling skirting boards and door surrounds. Do you think the mold can seep through?

Cheryl Mead 22:03
Yes, we know it does. So this, the first thing that you’ve got to really get your head around is that mouth actually isn’t the problem. moisture is. So you can’t really kill mold because viable spores are non viable is still toxic. So viable means that they’re living as in growing on the hi fi from the bank, and non-viable, which did sports but that’s still toxic. So once they grow, they do pretty much transfer in the air, especially if you’ve got any air circulation, like air conditioners going. So they can be distributed around the house, and you bring them in. So that’s where we basically have come in contact with them out of the center inside a building, if you can see this moisture, you know, there’s mold, this absolutely, I can guarantee you that when there’s moisture this mold this mold, you have to deal with the moisture problem. Okay, and then you deal with the mold. So the mold needs to be removed, it can’t be sprayed.

Molly Knight 23:09
So how how do you do that?

Cheryl Mead 23:13
Well, if it’s inside the wall, then generally going to replace the wall and claim up what it is wet and get rid of the moisture, what depends on the moisture comes from if it’s stone damage, and it’s a one off thing. That’s that’s sort of easier than if it’s a structural building problem. In other words, that the you don’t have enough gaffers for the heavy rain events have you might have broken water pipe somewhere that underneath the home or seeping into the underneath the home and you’ll get more growing underneath the if it’s a not a slab but a a pair of bank construction with tin floors. Look at mold growing and perform and it will penetrate the home.

Molly Knight 24:03
Okay, so yeah, I guess well, what? Yeah, a band aid solution doesn’t work. It’s not No. Those nice chemicals that you can buy to spray, not much use.

Cheryl Mead 24:19
You can play mode off on the surface and just wipe it down with with a non toxic detergent like anything that’s not another chemical because that that as a as another toxin to your environment. But you actually have to get rid of it. Like you have to wipe it clean or brush it plain. That’s what the malgor maybe I just do they actually created a tight compartment. If it’s in one room, they don’t distribute it to the rest of the house and then they take all the damaged materials out and they clean it up. And that’s how you make good bicycle.

Molly Knight 24:56
Huh? Okay, okay. Yeah All right, so hang on. Sure. Helen is just saying the water damage is in between the wall between the shower and the toilet. So that’s an internal wall, isn’t it between the shower and the toilet? So they still have to address it the same way, wouldn’t they?

Cheryl Mead 25:18
Yes, Rebecca could very well be the waterproof membranes have failed on the actual that. So this, what it doesn’t actually just cause mold it actually causes structural damage. So, mold is like a decomposer. So when you get an entire structure or plaster board or any building material, I mean, concrete probably isn’t so much an issue that it will actually gradually decompose and deconstruct the building. So it’s, it reduces the structural integrity. So you have to get to the source of it. If it is the you can do testing obviously for for moisture, depending on what you think it is, if there hasn’t been a flooding event or a rain event or a broken water pipe, it could be that the the waterproof membranes on the shower, I have failed. And it’s it’s penetrating through the grout lines into the wall or through the shower, in some way and affecting the internal cavity. So the and that really means probably a bathroom renovation.

Molly Knight 26:31
Hmm. Starting to sound expensive, isn’t it?

Cheryl Mead 26:34
It can be

Molly Knight 26:39
Hmm. So if you’ve got so if you’ve got water damage, you’ve got mold, that’s you’re peddling gloves, so to speak. Yeah, for a length of time.

Cheryl Mead 26:49
So in other words, if you have water damage, you may clean it up within 48 hours. Now you won’t you won’t have a problem. Because anyone wants to sit for a length of time that Rice was allowed to grow and multiples are everywhere. They’re pretty much indoors outdoors. They’re everywhere. They just exists. It’s It’s It’s they’re designed actually to decompose things so that everything goes back to the earth. So they’re not outdoors. They’re not a problem.

Molly Knight 27:21
Exactly. We, we need them, we need to have models. Yeah. So I’m just going back to Helen has problem, would it? Could you do a bit of Band Aid treatment, say you don’t have the money to rip out the wall and do all that? Would you be able to put a dehumidifier in there? Would that be of assistance or not really?

Cheryl Mead 27:45
Yes, but really, you’re going to find out what the source of the water is first. So and you really can’t do that without some sort of assessment. And what we do was we actually do what’s called moisture mapping. So we have equipment, which actually will detect moisture in materials, or substrate, you know, like floors, you can actually test concrete, if it’s, if it has water penetration through it. on concrete, you get what’s called efflorescence, which is sort of like salty scaling, or brickwork. And that’s a sign that you’ve got more than once, you can also come up from the ground like what’s called waiting. So it can be set up through a building or building structure. Because the water in the ground is too high. There’s too much water in a wall. If it’s a bathroom in there’s been no other broken pot. If for instance, it’s not running somewhere else outside, then the actual water from the shower is what’s causing it. And that’s what’s pretty much penetrating the wall. The waterproofing Brian has filed and it’s it’s causing water to get through into the other side. If you haven’t, Mm hmm. Okay, okay. You can test that with with moisture meters.

Molly Knight 29:08
Yeah, okay. You can you buy moisture meters, or would you get a building biology dance,

Cheryl Mead 29:16
it would be best to get someone professionally introduced. Because Because you don’t just look at that one area, there wasn’t a whole heap of things you can do that essentially will surface anything which bio types you actually collect the air and it goes through a bio pump which actually captures the what’s in the air and puts it onto a little disc and then you send that off for analysis. And that will if you’re not sure if you’ve got mold problems that will identify whether you have mold or not. Okay, that will tell you also what gender it is if it’s how toxic it is and if it’s and and the amount of it. So the way we do it. Everything is done. through a process, but that’s, that’s what you would do if you wanted to know, if you couldn’t see mold, and you want to have to have it, that’s what you do.

Molly Knight 30:08
Right? Okay. And is I mean, there’s black mold, green mold, pink mold, which which molds are the worst? For humans,

Cheryl Mead 30:18
there are some very specific mode set. When you when you get into doing the testing or mold sampling on the handout that I gave you actually gives you a list of some of them. So aspergillus second boisterous check, no, that’s, that’s toxic like mode. Yes, there’s lots of different modes, actually, heaps paid off little bit much more, more toxic to humans or even animals than others. But you might know what they are to do, simply to take some sort of air or some sample you won’t know what they are.

Molly Knight 31:10
So what would be the the biological effects of living in these water damaged homes or I think working in an environment because you know, you’re in an in a work environment for you know, eight or nine hours a day, so that if you’ve got a water damage building, that must just be equally as bad.

Cheryl Mead 31:35
Yeah, so the thing, the thing about once you actually if you if you’re susceptible to mold, in other words, if you don’t produce any bodies, it will have like a bioaccumulation on the body. So the more you breathe in the city you get, for people who actually do produce antibodies, their bodies will fight it off. So they may actually have exposure to the time, they may have lots of cold and flu symptoms, like congestion, sinus problems, and that sort of thing. But, but they will code so they will be able to get over it. If you’ve got, if you’ve got a lot of mold problems, it could be causing lots of other things. And I’ll just run through the list because, and there’s more than that, but most people won’t realize the effect that long will have on them, and could be classified as having chronic fatigue or, or, or other problems which because then it’s not identified. So it causes like body aches and pains. It actually, if you wake up in the morning, stiff all the time, it can be from mold, causes light sensitivity and blurred vision. A cough or shortness of breath, abdominal pain can cause diarrhea, causes memory and, and learning disability or it’s hard to pay to retain things. Or you can have confusion or think or brain fog where you just can’t remember what you did. And causes like disorientation or poor concentration. And mood swings can cause anger, numbness and tingling, muscle tremors, or skin conditions. So when you actually have exposure to mold, if you’re affected by it, other exposures will be will increase it for instance, if you if you have a lot of wireless devices or electromagnetic radiation, which is read frequencies, they will actually make the, the conditions worse, and sometimes by up to 800%. worse. So what what often happens is when we do an assessment, for instance, we go into someone home, someone’s home, often because they’ve seen a doctor or a integrated GP or a naturopath and they’ve said look, get your home checked out. Because we can’t we have one of these find out for something in the homemade music. It can be mild, but it can be negative, or it could be chemicals. So they all have the same or similar effects on the body. So EMF for instance, is symptoms from exposure to electromagnetic frequencies. And they can have very similar fixed effects to mold. So I’ve actually done some home assessments with them. I thought they had mold, but an ended up being that they were just looking really close to a telephone transmission town.

Molly Knight 34:47
Oh, gosh. Okay.

Cheryl Mead 34:48
Yeah. And so, this, the symptoms for electrical sensitivity are very similar. So you could actually be confused, thinking it’s mould, but it’s actually I’m

Molly Knight 35:01

Cheryl Mead 35:02
Yeah. So that’s, that’s one of the things that we have to look for, is to identify, we look at everything, we don’t just look things in isolation.

Molly Knight 35:11
Hmm. Yeah. I was gonna say would it be fair to say that a lot of people who have all these multiple symptoms, get diagnosed as you know psychosomatic problems or diagnosed with auto immune illnesses?

Cheryl Mead 35:29
Absolutely. It is really common, or when you can’t find a solution, you can’t get better is that we, they told that we afforded on yourself, which is actually not true. By offering those that and in along with that goes, mental illness, you know, like depression or anxiety. And, and then the person doesn’t feel that there any, any solution to it? And there’s a there’s a really good was quite a few actually papers, scientific research that actually shows that people who do not get recovery can actually end up being severely disabled, physically and mentally unable to suicide because of,

Molly Knight 36:17
hmm, gee, yeah, and we certainly have quite a rise in suicides, a lot to do with, you know, the COVID thing I believe, and that may not be correct. So possible, but I think if, if we looked a bit deeper at people’s environments, and perhaps we would have a little less mental and emotional illnesses.

Cheryl Mead 36:44
Well, that the thing that I’ve noticed is always and I’m gonna say, especially for me, because I had no idea of the environmental factors that were actually I suppose affected me. So I, I’m actually chemically sensitive, have always been sensitive. But it was only when I moved into the city that I actually, and it was if it hadn’t studied, wouldn’t it I would have thought it was just old age. But I’m actually electrically sensitive.

And I became even more so to the extent that I’m now hypersensitive, so I had to move. But I likened it to rapid aging. So rapid aging on the body, where you have inflammation, you have joint pain, you have inability, you lose everything from flexibility to, to you don’t sleep oil to everything from hot flashes to palpitations to an extreme case of I think it was probably a panic attack brought on by EMF, but it felt like it was habitat. And that that’s enough to actually make me realize I had to move. But yeah, so I can relate to people now when they they have problems that I’m sorry, it’s a it to me it’s a loss. And if I hadn’t been ology I would not have known what was wrong.

Molly Knight 38:16
Exactly. You’d be here labeled with all sorts of things, perhaps. So how do you then choose so you know that you have to move? But how do you make that choice of where to move to?

Cheryl Mead 38:31
Okay, so, for me, I’m really lucky, because I have all the tests to prove. So I guess for radio frequencies and, and electric fields and dirty electricity. And they’re the they’re the things that impact you the most. So when you look at the new build, you need to assess how close it is to a telephone tower. Is it close to transmission lines, the things that you don’t want electrical heating in the floor.

And, and where the solar inverter is so that solver inverter if you have solar panels, you don’t want that anyway, neither bedrooms, it can produce the electricity, things that produce the electricity or things like diamond switches, and any, any power that goes through a changing power like from a computer into a PowerPoint, so you’ll get you get in a field or an energy field coming off appliances, sometimes it’s really hard to do. So I bumped up tasted ranchos I’ve got one here I can’t use because it’s produces a massive amount of electricity from parts of air is a magnetic field from the unit itself to the extreme level. And so I wouldn’t know that except I was standing next to and I just kept feeling really bad really bad. So I got out my going out my equipment. And it was like in the I won’t go into it but but that the reading was in the extreme level. So radio frequencies for instance for eight tests in microwatts per cubic meter. And when we test the magnetic fields, I see electric fields and magnetic fields we test them in many gas or or in NEMA Tesla’s so we have a standard that we work to so we know what’s safe

Molly Knight 40:39
right. And that’s from your range hood Oh, I never thought, range hood. Yeah, suppose anything electrical? Isn’t it has the potential to be of harm to certain people talking about that. What about these antibodies? Some people have them some don’t? Can you explain a little bit more there Cheryl,

Cheryl Mead 41:00
Oh the stuff with mold when the seven normal years or a year mold? Sorry, yeah, so the normal immune system, actually, it pretty much it’s our native intelligence it kicks in. And it knows when we’re actually exposed to a toxin. So it builds up builds up anybody so it gets rid of it. So that’s what happens when you get a cold. So you might be exposed to some germs. And those germs actually, were made up of bacteria, basically more bacteria than what we ourselves. So it’s a period, which is part of our immune system. And when when our immune system kicks in, it fights off those toxins. So normal, will say, people that produce antibodies will actually fight the toxin from the mouth. So you can have one person in a house who has those antibodies and can fight the toxin produced by the mold, and they won’t get sick. Goats basically be fine. And then you have another person who doesn’t produce them, and they will get really sick. And so what happens is the person that’s not getting sick, there’s a delay, the other person is getting sick from the environment, because they’re not sick, so often is really confusing to people. And I’ve had discussions with these people will it a good example is that the bucks, okay, and the wife’s really sick, and he thinks its all in the head. I’m ok I’m not sick it can’t be the environment.

Molly Knight 42:29
Sounds very familiar.

Cheryl Mead 42:32
Yeah, so the person who doesn’t produce any bodies, their toxins build up. And the end, the the mold, when it breaks, gets into the body, it breaks through cell membranes, and it sort of like has a really toxic effect. And you have to go through, you do need to seek specialist help to be able to deal with it. But if you don’t remove the mold, or if you don’t get rid of if you don’t move out of that mold environment, for instance, to get rid of that a lot of the times with if it’s the same, so if you’re sensitive to electrical equipment, or what radio frequencies, which is all wireless devices, if you remove them, then you basically have no effect your body heals. So that’s what I do. So I help people set up really healthy environments so that whether they get better, because there’s the what’s causing the problem isn’t there anymore? Or they do it as a prevention, some of them would say don’t want to get sick. Yeah. And that’s what really when we get into children’s health, that’s what’s really critical. Yes. So, yeah,

Molly Knight 43:41
yeah, we’re looking forward to that. So if you are having health issues, which it’s a jigsaw of what can cause health issues these days, because of the pollution in the air, and our water and the toxicity in foods, and medications, and so on. But if you’re having health issues, and you’ve explored all your medical avenues, it would be reasonable to think maybe it’s your home environment. So how, what would be the steps? So you’d call someone like yourself and say, you know, come and see what’s happening in my house?

Cheryl Mead 44:25
Yeah, so we have a, there is a pretty strict protocol that we follow in relation to doing an assessment. And the first one is to get to because what we do is find this first because we don’t actually treat the person or diagnose the person, we, we diagnose the environment, and we basically treat the environment. So we solve the environmental problems, as opposed to solving a problem of a symptom. So the symptom is a sign there’s something wrong. Yes, I got a symptom and it could be just constant current flows or it could be that you can’t sleep at night, whatever it is, then that’s not natural. So when we go into someone’s home, usually it’s because they have a problem, it could be from mold. So someone has not been able to get better, or they diagnosed with chronic fatigue, which is a thing, a diagnosis that they make when they can’t work out what it is. So then the other problems can be related to children or adults who have children especially potentially had a head cause for children that that were okay. And then all of a sudden, they were diagnosed as being on the autism spectrum. And they’ve gone to the, they’ve been cleaning up the environment. So getting rid of all the, the, the toxins in their home, so moving to really healthy, natural cleaning products, but they’ve also reduced the chemicals in their food in their diet, they’ve cleaned that up. And then the next step is to clean up the environment. I have noticed people is children who have been diagnosed with autism, and they’ve got them off the autism spectrum, by going through a whole range of things, including removing, or mold is one. So if you’ve got mold, it can actually have an effect. And if you’ve got a lot of wireless technology in your home, that can have an effect on on young children. So what we do is we go into a home, and we have a fairly lengthy questionnaire. So we we get lots of historical evidence about the health of the people in the home, about the history of the home, what’s happened in the home, what they’ve introduced into the home since or prior to them getting sick, and, and anything that we can actually assess about behind. So we we asked lots of questions about, you know, all the things that they use. And that even gets down to do you have an electric blanket, you know,

Molly Knight 47:02
it’s like, okay, yeah,

Cheryl Mead 47:04
what’s happening on an on an electromagnetic field. That’s the first stage. And then we actually it depends on what we’re there for. If it’s for mold assessment, we would be looking for moisture damage. If there’s been a rain event, if there’s been a storm event, if they’ve had, for instance, a like a washing machine has flooded in the laundry, but they haven’t really cleaned it up properly. So in other words that didn’t get all the moisture, the water could be sitting underneath the flooring, it could be in the walls, it may still be there, you can test for that with a moisture meter. You can also look for signs. so swollen timber, and carpet that’s been discovered discolored, things like plaster board that’s actually swollen. And a really big problem is particle board. So not many people know that particle board or what’s called MDF, medium density fiberboard or the flooring, which is made up of like what we used to just call it chipboard is those products are really loaded with formaldehyde. formaldehyde is in built into those products, it’s part of the process of making them. And formaldehyde is a class one carcinogen, so it’s extremely toxic. Once mold grows on that, that’s what traits that toxicity in the multiple. So we have to identify if there’s if there’s water on the floor or on flooring, that’s that’s chipboard, or in tablets, for instance, a lot of the white melon line underneath it is just what’s called. It can be it can be MDF, or it can be just really pretty cheap from China. So there’s no restrictions in China in relation to formaldehyde. We have restrictions on how much Malahide you can have in a product made in Australia. So if you’re buying Australian made products, or if you know how to look for healthy products, you don’t have to have these toxins in your home.

Molly Knight 49:12
So he’s saying if if a product’s coming from a country where there are restrictions and there’s no import restrictions, that you could be actually well, poisoning I suppose for want of a better word, making yourself sick by your cupboards. Oh, yeah. Yeah.

Cheryl Mead 49:36
A good example is my my son was actually renovating his house and I’ll go and visit him on a regular basis. Every time I would go there, I would have her reaction. But one day I was actually really bad. And as soon as I walked in, I could feel it in my throat and I just felt absolutely terrible. I said okay, so what have you bought? So firstly, what have you introduced into the house because the house was never finished. They said oh, we just bought some new blinds. And I knew straightaway, so products that come in from China, for instance, and metro system is a good example, products coming from China, they use formaldehyde, when they pack them into a crate to stop them from creasing, because it’s sort of like for a decrease product, or has a benefit for that. It all it also is lots of uses for that height. So I won’t get into all that. But the thing is formaldehyde ever built into the product or put on the product when it leaves China, when they’re brought here, and everything’s like, a good example, this this blinds and that when they come in a pack that he bought and opened up the plastic pack, and that emits all the volatile organic compounds, which is formaldehyde is one of them. And they stayed within that room or within their home, until they gradually get filtered out. And we become the filter. So we breathe them in, into our bodies, and our bodies filled service and their bodies and we breathe out plane in. So bit like tap water. So if you don’t have a filter on your, on your town water, which has poor rains and disinvestment, in disinfection by products and fluoride, then our body filters it. So we absorb the toxins, we become the filter. So when you actually introduce these things into your home, if you don’t know that they loaded, then they stay in that environment, often for a very long time. And that I had, I just knew when I walked into my son’s house, I said, Oh, you’ve got something. And sure enough, it was the new blinds that he put up. So this is why when we get into children’s health, we need to understand, okay, so they are more effective than us. We’ll talk about that more later. But there’s lots that we can actually do to stop that from happening. And one is obviously know a little bit more about how to select products.

Molly Knight 52:01
Yeah, exactly. It’s very important. I certainly didn’t realize how important that would be. So with your son’s blinds, what? Because even if he’s not noticing an adverse effect from it, it would have to be adversely affecting their health. His body heal. Yeah. So what would you suggest he does in that case, or anybody who’s putting in new new products

Cheryl Mead 52:30
are a couple of little tips. So when you buy something new from the shop doesn’t matter whether it’s insane, you buy a mattress, or or a something that’s covered in a plastic wrap. Don’t take the plastic wrap off inside, take it off outside, okay, you can air it out for a while, lick it off, guess what s means it actually gradually off gases into the air, not into your home outside. Everything’s bearing things that is real. The other thing you said do some research before you buy it. So there’s some really good companies in Australia that make products that are non toxic, that they cater for the the community that are looking for them. So you ask lots of questions. Is my recommendation

Molly Knight 53:20
is same

Cheryl Mead 53:22
thing with will say? Well, I have known mattresses connection calls, because you’re sleeping on a mattress to get a new mattress, you put them into your kid’s bedroom. And then I would put stories of children being really sick from sleeping on a brand new mattress. And that’s because it’s been it’s full of potentially from aldehyde. But also things like they treat, they treat treat fabrics for all sorts of reasons. So you don’t want to buy antifungal products because they treated them with a chemical or a pesticide.

Molly Knight 54:03

Cheryl Mead 54:04
So they’re not recommended and your own. If you actually look at some of the products that that are that are produced in outside of Australia. When they when they come here, they come in bulk and they want mattresses for instance, and most people didn’t, wouldn’t know this that they actually put mattresses in like a metal cage. And they squash them down really, really, really tight. So they push all the era of them. And what happens the reason I put formaldehyde on it because when they come to Australia, they they come in a container, compacted and then they’re put into a big sort of mesh cage, where they actually pretty much unseal them so, so they go boom and that and the mattresses, just expand formaldehyde actually stops the materials from increasing. That’s why they use formaldehyde. But you know that. So, so that’s sort of how it ends up in so they really loaded. Or they could have things things like clothing that is traded with us. It’s not flammable, like the previous

Molly Knight 55:25
year, the fireretardant.

Cheryl Mead 55:27
Yeah, that’s it, this was wonderful. So that’s really toxic. So all clothes that you buy, you should wash before you ever put them on your children. Even the things that you bring into your home, like pillows and that they really need for pillow covers, for instance, they need to be washed before they use. And, or if it’s something that needs to be aired out, leave it outside and sunlight is a great source of things.

Molly Knight 55:56
So just replacing your pillows would be, you know, a similar thing, wouldn’t it? You know, stick it outside in there, stick it on the line in the sun for a day or so. And yeah,

Cheryl Mead 56:08
yeah. I mean, just some little tips. You know, there’s lots of little things that you can do if you know a little bit about where where the toxins are, where they where things are manufactured makes a difference. I would say, I would say look for Australian made products, because we have really better regulations here.

Molly Knight 56:27
Yes, that’s that’s definitely true. We do. Yeah. And,

Cheryl Mead 56:32
and that you do a little bit hogwash. Yeah, there is a website for people to go to if they want to know more about what’s toxic and whatnot. And that’s the Environmental Working Group. So that’s out of the US, and they have lots of information for people if they want to actually do some research. And there’s a healthy building network, but it’s quite an event. to them.

Molly Knight 56:57
Mm hmm. Yeah, I think I guess the the greatest stumbling block would be people aren’t aware, they don’t have the awareness to to think, Oh, well, this is happening physically for me or mentally, I should be looking at my my home or, or my new cupboards or my new carrying. And people trot off to the doctor and get diagnosed somehow. And perhaps it was the home all along.

Cheryl Mead 57:27
Yeah, actually just mentioned new cars. But if anyone realizes you, people sometimes say I really love that new car smell.

Molly Knight 57:35

Cheryl Mead 57:37
Well, that’s actually producing the volatile organic compounds from all the plastics and vinyls. So vinyl is a really toxic product. It’s the least favored bitmoji product because it produces toxins when it’s produced, many of mine is manufactured. And it actually also will offset so things like vinyl flooring or vinyl covers, things like that will actually contribute to the essays in the home environment once they’re trapped indoors. And then when they put in demand field, they release even more toxins. So we try to Yeah, polyvinyl chloride or PVC is a is really toxic. So we try and steer clear of those sorts of products. Whereas on the added compared to vinyl flooring, things like linoleum, which is natural base from linseed is actually a really healthy choice on the Malian. So there’s sort of some some things that we point people in the direction of, if they’re healthy alternatives.

Molly Knight 58:45
Yeah, that’s good to know. So can people do you have a webpage with all this information? Or do you have something that you could give me that we can pop onto our web page so people can get some more information? Because I think this is, I think, probably for me as a practitioner, I think mold, which I do harp on about a bit I know, but I think it’s like a missing link to things like cancer, fibromyalgia, chronic fatigue, any of the auto immune diseases. I think, in every aspect of health, there’s a mold link. That’s just my sense of health care. But people aren’t aware of it. And I mean, there’s other aspects as well of course with the electromagnetic fields and radiation and so on, but have you got leases or something that people can

Cheryl Mead 59:42
infect sheets, which I I look, there’s a lot of science and the real problem with scientists that they are not easy documents to read or decipher. So they’re not in normal language that we can relate to. There are some are have some some factsheets on my website under Resources, and so there is one on mode, which you’ve actually got the copy off. So you can actually put that up on your website. If you’re new.

Molly Knight 1:00:09
Thank you. Yeah,

Cheryl Mead 1:00:10
I have some in relation to like information, endocrinology and why I think it is such a great subject. It’s also effects on EMF and how to assess things like exposure to EMF, which is a little bit more technical. And I would have to say, a public would prefer to actually do some training with people to get their head around it, because it’s not something that is easily understood.

Molly Knight 1:00:39
So it’s quite a very complex,

Cheryl Mead 1:00:43
yes, but definitely, so Richie Shoemaker, who actually is has a mold website, surviving mold, or something like that, from the US has a lot of information to go to, as well as the just want to think wherever where the best place to go to or the fact sheet actually has lots of links, or links to information. And if people know that there was a parliamentary inquiry into biotoxin illness, which is mold, and there is on the Australian government website, if you google biotoxin, illness, parliamentary inquiry, one of those in those terms, you will get a link to the government website where people would in submissions, and there’s lots of stories there in relation to the the health effects and stories about people wanting the government to change the laws around mold in buildings. In other words, it’s not it’s not illegal to rent out a building if it’s full of mold, for instance. And and there’s no there’s no odors on on building is to fix mold problems. And, and I just really seriously think that there should be some, no, I caught it. Great. Yeah. I have actually bought the mean in the UK. So we we do usually follow what happened. Certainly we did good work health and safety or occupational safety. Yeah. So maybe one day they will hear and it hasn’t happened yet. There’s lots of submissions in relation to actually you’ll find Tim law submission on that Australian parliamentary website. Okay, I have a copy if anyone wants wants a copy of it. And which relates to the home building industry, if if builders want to be conscientious and understand how to build a safe home? construction, yeah.

Molly Knight 1:02:57
as they should, as they should. Yeah. And people do what they they have to to what the law says. But if there’s no, um, there’s no regulation around the mold, or the damage, water damage? I don’t know. Just, that seems a little unfair.

Cheryl Mead 1:03:20
If it does, because that’s passing the buck to someone else in like that, the whole industry building industry, and I’m part of it my whole family’s in the industry, but but for, as we know, there’s always there’s always the good people, and there’s always the bad people. So you have to understand that the more we focus on the goal, the better outcomes we’re going to get.

Molly Knight 1:03:47
Yeah, absolutely. And, yeah, I guess research research and yeah, look by Aussie made, it’s pretty simple, isn’t it? Really?

Cheryl Mead 1:03:58
Yeah. What and and check with the with the manufacturers, because what we do is when we look for a product, any product, we always look for a safety data sheet, and we assess what’s not many people will actually be able to assess that. Otherwise, they will help you whether or not it meets the guidelines. So that’s what we look for. So the content material, for instance, the formaldehyde in in a building product is listed, and you can search for low levels. So there’s companies that actually make safer paddleboarders make safer plywood, which is the lowest amount of formaldehyde is which I think is fine. There’s a company in Queensland that actually make really high quality products, which I would specify because because they pretty much tell you what’s what’s the In the product and the safe levels or the safest levels that you can get.

Molly Knight 1:05:04
Mm hmm. Yeah, that’s awesome. Okay, so mold, mold electromagnetic sensitivities. It’s, um, we’ve got a lot to battle, don’t we as human beings on this planet these days?

Cheryl Mead 1:05:21
Yeah, well, I think actually, people think it’s just more than I think it’s mold. And the chemical sort of that that the mold is growing on. That’s what actually creates the the micro toxins or the microbial VRC. So we had to understand it’s not all modes, bad. So why are the ones in buildings so bad? And you’ve got to think about Okay, so what are they growing them? As opposed to outside where they would naturally be? Yeah, okay. Yeah, that’s about it. Yes. So there’s lots of things in plasterboard, there’s lots of things in paddleboarding in carpets and in Nathan furnishings at the end of the day, so some furnishings will actually be affected if they get water damaged. And if they are loaded with chemicals or flame retardants, then that’s actually what the fine is fading on. And that’s things in the air, the tiny spores break off and they filter into the air and then we break them in.

That’s where it’s very Be patient.

Molly Knight 1:06:29
It does go pear shaped, doesn’t it. So just to recap, a dehumidifier, keep your windows open, I guess to keep airflow

Cheryl Mead 1:06:41
windows up, especially think of a nice sunny day make a really good habit, as long as you’re not right next to a freeway or something because you get a lot of pollution for measles. But But yeah, if you’re in a nice leafy suburb, yeah, open your windows up. Not when the wind is howling or anything. But yeah, in your house and a bit more. Sun, sunlight is a really, really good sort of antiseptic, so put things outside like your mattresses every now and then if you cannot put them up to the air, because you’ll have issues like dust mites and things like that. We haven’t gotten into them today. But But Love Bites can affect people with asthma and things like that. So it is and then just cleaning products. It’s just a really simple solution, you know, don’t introduce toxic products into your home. Even the food you eat. I really I don’t think people are aware of the problems caused by food.

Molly Knight 1:07:41
Maybe we can touch on that next Tuesday night when you join. Yeah, that’d be me. And we’ll have a talk about that. But one of the keys. Yeah, definitely. Yeah. And that’s all these as well.

Cheryl Mead 1:07:53
Yes. Yes. But But having said that people will depend on where they’re at in life, you know, pins on everyone goes through stages, don’t they? Yes. Yeah, exactly.

Molly Knight 1:08:10
Yeah. Yeah. So

Cheryl Mead 1:08:13
if you have any questions that people want down the track, then there’s a couple of handouts on action are available for people. They’re actually on my website as well, if I made them, and the fact sheets for mold, and water damage, and EMF, and the websites wicked

Molly Knight 1:08:35
will list that on our page so that people can can see us and remembers. And thank you. That was a lot of information. And I’m sure it’s probably only a minute amount of what we could discuss. But it was very informative. And I certainly learned a lot. So thanks, Cheryl. That was really fabulous. Yeah, that’s fine, really. And I really look forward to Tuesday as well, where we’ll discuss some pregnancy and environmental toxins and a safe pregnancy foods, obviously, we’re going to touch on foods and, and children’s health and how to perhaps lessen the burden that we have around us now. So do join us next week, folks. Thank you, Cheryl. Really, really pleased that you could join us tonight. Okay, bye. Bye. Thank you, everyone, for joining us. Thanks for staying with us. And we’ll put all Cheryl’s details up on our web page, so that you can download some of the information she’s got and have a look at her website and see what she she can do. And yeah, let’s see. One more thing to add to our little toolkit to be healthier in this world that we’ve all created. So Thanks for joining us. Join us next Tuesday night for another talk with Cheryl. I think you’ll find that really interesting as well. I’m looking forward to it. Good night. Stay safe.



Matt Wong joined Molly Knight to discuss the COVID-19 Omnibus (Emergency Measures) and Other Acts Amendment Bill 2020. Matt analysed the Bill and what it means for Victorians.



Matt has had a very interesting range of careers. He started as a pilot before moving on to own a medical clinic. He studied law twice (under grad and post grad) but disliked it so switched to business and obtained an MBA. He has started and sold many companies, worked for corporates in robotics and A.I. and more recently started making content in an effort to be helpful to others every day.

Click on the image below to watch the full interview:


The full transcript follows  – E&OE :

Molly Knight 0:02
Hello, everyone, welcome to Health Australia Party. I’m Molly. Tonight we’ve got a really interesting talk about the omnibus bill, Victoria. And tonight we’re talking with Matt Wong. Now, Matt’s a very interesting character. I don’t know too many people who’ve studied law twice because they wanted to, but he has. He started off as a trainee. pilot, then moved into law. And then, for whatever reasons, didn’t like that. And then he switched and went into business and did his MBA. So he’s got a really varied and interesting career. And a lot of knowledge comes with all that learning and experience. So welcome, Matt, thank you so much for joining us tonight.

Matt Wong 0:52
Thank you, Molly. Hello to everyone.

Molly Knight 0:56
So tonight, Matt, we want I want to talk to you about Victoria. Wonderful, Victoria.

Matt Wong 1:03
sad story.

Molly Knight 1:04
It’s a very sad story. But it you know, this covid virus obviously loves Victoria, because it’s the only state that has such draconian measures in place. So around the world, as far as I know, nobody, nobody is shut down, like Victoria is, and they’re trying to even enforce it more. With an omnibus bill, can you please tell me what an omnibus bill is?

Matt Wong 1:33
It’s a very common thing where we need to make a lot of small changes to an act. So an act is just a piece of legislation, a law, and a bill is a baby act, once it gets voted into law, it becomes an act. So when we have to edit a lot of acts at the same time we pass an omnibus bill. Now, the problem with this omnibus bill, of course, is that it’s much as a whole bunch of little things. It’s a whole bunch of little things plus sneaky little, little insertion at the end there.

Molly Knight 2:02
Yeah, yeah, it’s um, it covers quite a few areas doesn’t have government, the juvenile area, the health area. Yeah. And what so in this bill, what do you think are the most important points that Victorians need to one be aware of? And to do something about what are the points that need to be stressed to the people that this is taking away so much more of their freedoms? I believe, I believe anyway, that’s what’s happening.

Matt Wong 2:38
Do you want me to jump straight to the horrors of it?

Molly Knight 2:41
Yes, please, Matt. As bad as it can get jumping.

Matt Wong 2:45
You’re not you’re not alone in thinking that you’re in good company, former Chief Justice of the High Court of Australia, Justice McHugh, a number of distinguished q C’s have all come out today, twice, actually, today, they came out and a different lot came out a couple of days ago, writing an open letter. What we’re looking at now is the most authoritarian laws that we have ever seen in Australia that are more akin to a despotic society, which we would never have dreamed could come to Australia. So I guess if we cut right to the point, we are looking at a bill that is going to allow the Department of Health and Human Services to appoint anybody to become a delegated authorized officer to exercise the emergency powers which are contained in Section 200 of our public health and well being act. And that’s things like locking us down. The scary part is not so much that they’re going to exercise these powers for further six months. It’s that anyone is going to be able to do it that they appoint even with no qualifications, and they’re going to be do they’re going to be able to detain us before we commit crimes. So we’re entering into a world of pre crime enforcement similar to Minority Report, the movie with Tom Cruise.

Molly Knight 4:02
Hmm. That doesn’t really make sense unless suddenly all these people are great psychics and can predict what crimes coming?

Matt Wong 4:10
Well, it seems odd that you would put very tricky and discretionary powers into the most untrained, I mean, at the moment, we’re seeing big poll, Victoria, please do some things that are they’re making a lot of mistakes. And even if it’s a minority of they’re very well trained force, they’re a very well trained force. And so to think we are now going to put even further discretion in powers into the hands of VSOs public service public safety officers I think they call or even public servants, and this is not an exaggeration. In the front of the bill. There’s an explanatory memorandum, and it literally says that they want to put this power into the hands of public servants.

Molly Knight 4:53
just doesn’t make any sense to me. None of this in Victoria is making any sense

Matt Wong 5:00
Well, a lot of us are trying to figure out why. And there are theories You know, there’s there’s the the more fringe I guess, I feels mean when I say fringe I don’t mean that in a bad way. But I guess there’s less of them on the on the on the right, far right, who would say, Oh, he’s, he’s evil he wants to sell us to try and he’s trying to take over the country and make us into a gulags like Nazi Germany. And you’ve got the other side on the left who are irrationally saying, I stand with Dan. He can do no wrong. I sit somewhere in the middle, I really think that he’s unfortunately destroying our state in many ways. And it’s not just my opinion. It’s the deputy Lord Mayor of Melbourne, who interviewed a couple of days ago. It’s Jim Penman from Jim’s mowing, who was in this room yesterday, it’s these people who are on the front line who are telling me how a state is being destroyed. Not just economically, I’ve had the COVID doctors in here in this room, the ones who originally wrote that letter, the original 12 or 13. And they’ve been telling me We are destroying this state, we are destroying the health of this state because of the increased deaths and so on that were causing mental health harms. I’ve even had the today I interviewed Sanjeev subblock. He’s the economist who resigned in protest from the Treasury and finance. And he’s saying we are killing people. So we’re doing a very bad thing down here, but I believe that Dan is trying to save us. I think he’s, I think he’s on a crusade. And I think he’s trying to save the state. And unfortunately, he’s destroying the state. And that’s the only thing I can think that can explain the craziness, the absurdity of it and why he doubles down and triples down on some of his policies.

Molly Knight 6:40
But Matt, what is it he’s trying to save Victoria from

Matt Wong 6:44
the Coronavirus that’s going to kill us all.

Molly Knight 6:48
That’s proven to be no worse than normal flu. But in fact, cancer death rate, heart disease, regular influenza deaths are all down because COVID numbers are up. So there’s something quite corrupt in that to start with.

Matt Wong 7:06
I didn’t come on here to hear a lot of reason, Molly, get out of here with your facts and your

Molly Knight 7:12
Oh, sorry, sorry, sorry, has to be off me. Yes. Why? What is it the savings from because you cannot even if this is a true new virus, you can’t protect people from viruses. They are everywhere. They’re on my glasses in my hair on my little headband. There. I’m breathing them, they are everywhere. So no matter how much you locked down people, you cannot stop this.

Matt Wong 7:41
The viruses aren’t all bad either. I mean, from a biological evolutionary biology perspective, they are part of if you believe in it, they’re part of the evolution of the human species. But look, I think he’s there’s another theory as well, which is more rational, perhaps, than even my theory, and that is from political insiders who have told me that he’s simply too deep. He’s He’s so deep, he can’t turn around and admit fault.

Molly Knight 8:06

Yeah. So he would, yeah, he just can’t admit that he’s gotten it wrong. And step back from it?

Matt Wong 8:15
Well, I can give you some interesting things, right. So there’s three things big pole, so I have contact inside, not inside contact, who has contacts inside big pole. And they currently doing exercises with ADF here in Melbourne. And they are saying that the that the morale and big pole is the lowest it’s ever been in a generate in a in a big pole generation. So in 1015 years of recruits, the ATF saying they are not enjoying working with Vic Paul, so much so that you’ve seen some videos where there’s one in particular where there’s an ADF member in a big poll harassing a lady for sitting down pregnant on a park bench, and the ADF member turns away from the camera and just kicks you right away from it. I think it’s becoming toxic. They’re losing their social license here in Victoria. So that’s the first signal the Treasury, the economist from the Department of Treasury and finance. They told me that almost unanimously, every single economist within Treasury and finance in Victoria agrees with his views, which is anti lockdown, and we’re killing people. And he resigned in protest. And he’s been in the news everywhere. Yes, he thinks there’s one, maybe two out of the 100 economists within our department, that a pro what Dan’s doing, and that our treasury department is advising Dan to do things differently and is frustrated that they that Dan is our premier is ignoring the advice being given to him.

Molly Knight 9:38
I mean, just doesn’t make sense. So his advice, he’s ignoring health advice, he’s ignoring advice on the economy. There has to be a reason apart from his ego. Apart from him thinking he’ll look stupid if he winds it back. I don’t know. I don’t know about the conspiracies. Going around, but something is very wrong here.

Matt Wong 10:04
something is very wrong. But I’m encouraged that if you think about more women we can start at a style was quite and get more complex from there. But the style was quick does it best when it says this is how democracy dies to thunderous applause. And it really sums up a lot of philosophical thought in that we don’t see dictatorships arise in, in protest, you always see them arise with the consent of the people. So the fact that Victoria is turning, we are seeing q C’s come out now. Businesses come out. So many people are coming up now, even the left wing media returning. I have great hope for Victoria. Because if they’re, if they’re waking up, then I don’t think we’re going to go full dictator then.

Molly Knight 10:47
Okay, well, that would be yes, that would be wonderful. Now, in this bill, and I was having a look at it earlier today. There seems to be and the media have definitely focused on this a little bit, that these people if this bill gets through the upper house, or the Legislative Council that he’s in Victoria isn’t up yet. So if it gets past it, these people with these new powers can detain children, I mean, they could be removed.

Matt Wong 11:18
No, no, no, calm down, everyone. Calm down.

I go great pains to make sure that you know my all of my content, I shouldn’t you found me through that video I made is accurate. The reason why I didn’t bring up the children is is causing a lot of fear, my inbox is flooded with moms afraid that the children are going away. Yeah, the power to remove children has always been there. And it’s generally what’s intended to be used in the case of delinquent parents, and so on. Right, we know that it’s always rested with the courts. So the courts have the ability to make those orders and family reunification orders and so on. Now, in the bill, it does make changes to some of those acts and the ability to extend family reunification, orders, and so on. However, it does not centralize power into the hands of the executive branch of government into the authorized officers or the police. It’s still specifically says that the courts can, and let me say something about the courts, we must have some faith in our courts in Victoria, you have to understand what’s happening here is 100%, not the fault of the courts, the courts have not been allowed to speak. So we have a separation of powers, you know, judiciary, executive and legislative people who make the laws, people who enforce the laws, the police and people who judge whether we’ve broken the law or not. So at the moment, every single COVID fire, not a single one has made it through to the courts yet this is our attorney general admitting this in the parliamentary accounts and estimates committee. Now one of the theories is that they don’t want it to get to the courts. Now putting the theory aside. It’s true that the laws are not being tested, because they’re not getting to the courts. So the judiciary, the judges, the courts have not been able to speak so we should not be angry at them. In fact, I’m hopeful that the most left wing state in Australia, the most progressive lenient, judges in Australia are here. So I’m hopeful that when it does get to the courts, we’ll finally get to see them play their hand and I suspect they are going to throw out quite a lot.

Molly Knight 13:18
Huh? Yeah. Okay. Yes, I guess, if you look at a bigger picture, overall, most people have a lot of common sense, don’t they?

Matt Wong 13:27
Especially on judiciary? Yes. I know. We have some weird stuff happening in the courts. But on the whole, they’re very good, huh?

Molly Knight 13:40
We’ve gone Sorry, sorry, people. I don’t know if anyone can see me or Oh, we just went. We just went blank. Sorry, everybody. I don’t know what’s happening. Some of my emails have been disappearing and all sorts of funny things happening. Anyway. Okay, so yes, so most, most people do have common sense and understand that this perhaps, has been handled in a very interesting manner. But with this omnibus bill, you know, this is pasture lower house. So that means there’s a lot of politicians who are saying, yep, let’s go for these changes.

Matt Wong 14:22
Okay, so this is an interesting story. We have it passed in low house because then Andrew is Labour government. Victoria has a massive majority in you know, low house. And so everything passes. However, I’ve just been told about 10 minutes ago before I jumped on with you, from someone who works in Spring Street in, in politics down here. That’s many of the MP The Labour MPs who are voting for it don’t want to now it makes sense that they have to have to follow party lines. They don’t like it. And a lot of them have supported the tilt at Dan’s leadership last week, where Tim palace was the front runner he did the numbers didn’t get the numbers. And so that’s why we started Coming up standing supporting Dan, this happens with every challenge happened, Turnbull. And Peter Dutton. It always happens, they do a first round, they don’t get the numbers and they come out and support them. So that’s first of all. And I’ve been given a name of one day to chase down because they really don’t like what Dan’s doing, see if I can interview them. So that’s good news. Now, Samantha, the greens have come out saying they don’t support this bill, because it’s bad, and it’s scary, and it’s arbitrary, and they will vote against it in the upper house. However, don’t forget everyone, those hypocrites called the greens voted for it in the low house. So there you go. Good news, though. The crossbenches. So this is where it will fail. Hopefully, in the upper house, it’s going to get there in the beginning to the middle of October. So we have a couple of weeks to three weeks. Yeah. And we lost the state of emergency fight by one vote, just 2119 on the measures that mattered. So if one flipped to would have been 2020, so fails, and has to win by a majority. So the upper house we’ve already had Fiona pattern who voted for the state of emergency she’s come out publican says she won’t support this bill in its current form. So I think just by that we’ve won the greens have said that they won’t support it in the house either. And that gives me hope that it won’t pass. But that said, this is the most serious thing I’ve seen in my family in my 30s. So maybe that doesn’t hold much weight. But other older people have said it’s the most serious change to what they’ve seen in their lifetimes. You see, yeah, on LinkedIn, the lawyers are out there saying it. So we need to fight.

Molly Knight 16:36
So what how do people do that? How does the public actually see what’s happening? And how do they get their voice? Heard?

Matt Wong 16:46
See what’s happening? Do you mean by like, well, we’re explaining

Molly Knight 16:50
Yeah, yeah, with with this bill, they, I mean, I’m absolutely amazed at the compliance of Victorians, with everything that’s been happening, I just, I don’t understand how they sit back. And maybe they’re only seeing the news on CHANNEL SEVEN, or nine or whatever. And they’re not really looking deeper at what’s going on, but to be singled out as a state with such severe restrictions. When all around the world the information is changing about how this virus is affecting people and the severity of it. We know it’s no worse than a flu. Why are they so compliancy? I don’t understand that. And so will they just be compliant with this bill? Will they sit back and say yes, Dan, come on, bring it on. Why are they jumping up and down? And if they want to jump up and down? How do they jump up and down? What do they do? Well, first of

Matt Wong 17:49
all, we have been squashed. If you look at the protest numbers around different cities in support of Victoria, you’ve had in Brisbane, I can’t remember what you had 1000 people or something out there. Sydney, you sorted Olympic Park a couple of weeks. So you had a lot. And the number of people who were intending to protest and he was very large. We had a Facebook group. We just Melbourne there was a Facebook group with over 115,000 members in it. 20,000 odd said that, yes, they’re going to the events, even if a quarter showed up, or a fifth showed up. We’re talking about a couple thousand people in protest. But we’ve had some of the most extreme draconian enforcement’s by police. You know, I did a video of the Queen Victoria markets was there that day buying food. I couldn’t believe what I saw. We are being scared into not I mean, we’ve had protests now every week since then of hundred people. So it’s obvious to me that even statistically speaking, it’s the curfews it’s the five kilometer limit. It’s the arresting for posting things on Facebook, see intimidation. It’s normal people like myself have DK phones now, in case we get raided by the police. It’s a joke. So first of all, I think that there is a resistance is just that we’re being squashed. What can we do? Well, mass civil disobedience would work. However, I would never suggest illegalities. I can’t I don’t want to be right about big poll. I don’t think we have I don’t think Victorians have the stomach for it. I think like you say we roll over. And we just allow the government to do what they like. So the only thing we can do is fight within the system. And that’s what they do. For example, with my friend Monica. She runs that page, reignite democracy Australia. It’s a respectful page where they do campaigns to email MPs and so on. I know you guys have something you have a tool where you can put in your address or something and it’ll tell you who your MPs are, so you can get their email address or whatever. So contacting the Labour MPs is key because a lot of them are dissatisfied with what’s going on.

Molly Knight 19:49
Yeah, that’s good to know. Because you don’t sort of hear that out there. So that’s really good information.

Matt Wong 19:55
I wouldn’t bother contacting the liberals. If I interview them in this room. I talked to I wouldn’t bother they’re all on board don’t waste their time. They’re all voting against, I wouldn’t bother contacting David limbrick from the Liberal Democrats or Tim quilty, they’re all, they’re all voting against it. It’s the labour people, we really need to convince them this coup to happen. We need, we need them to, we needed that coup to win, you know, the the Tim palace Leadership Challenge, something like that would be very, very good wouldn’t solve the problem, what labour would still be in, but they would be forced to make significant changes to their policy to justify the coup, that is a win. But other than that, we have to wake up is more important. We need to open our eyes and see what’s happening in front of us. And this goes for other states as well. You have to understand that governments, it’s not about what’s legal to bet what they can get away with. And we even had Dan Andrews today saying that the reason he locked down those towers was not because of powers under the public health and well being accidentally been seen. Now he’s claiming that they simply secure our quote, secured the site as the landlords of the government towers. So now he’s saying that as the landlords he used v. Paul to secure it in what would amount to a tort illegal tort of false imprisonment. So it’s all over the place, but he gets away with it. So please don’t allow other states, your states to get away with it because they Polly’s will look to Victoria. And they’ll see if the people of Victoria put up with it, then maybe the people of let’s say, who will put up with forced vaccinations, which is exactly what’s written into their Public Health Act, as in they can tie you down and inject you with what could be a perfectly safe vaccine? I don’t know. I’m not a doctor, but I’m just telling you, it’s in the Public Health Act.

Molly Knight 21:36
Hmm. Yeah, that’s, that’s enormously scary, because we don’t know what’s in it. And there’s a lot of information about vaccination programs around the world that have gone belly up very seriously. So yeah, when we don’t know. You know, we don’t have true choice. Oh, we can. I

Matt Wong 21:54
cannot Sorry to interrupt. Can I just emphasize to, you got to understand who this is coming from. I’m telling you to be careful of the vaccination thing and why I’m a fan of vaccinations. I’m vaccinated. My kids are vaccinated. So if I’m telling you to be careful, and holy hell, there’s something going wrong,

Molly Knight 22:10
huh? Yeah. Look, a lot of people that are very well, they’re, they’re vaccinated. They don’t they they believe in vaccines. And they’re saying, I don’t know about this vaccine because it’s so rushed. No way. Yeah, no, no, I think I don’t think many people will be silly enough to take something that’s not being well trialed, and so on. Yeah, I guess for me, I’m in New South Wales. So I look at it and I think okay, so if Victoria rolls on all of this, where does that leave the rest of Australia? Because if, yeah, Queensland wha they can certainly follow suit quite quickly. And then we’ve got the other states that I guess they may like the control or whatever it is, I don’t know what’s in these minds of these people. But we have to all of Australia needs to be aware of what’s going on. And, you know, talk talk to your members of parliament. You’re right. Just Just contact them. Matt, can we just backtrack a little bit? Are you able to tell them? just discuss a little bit because I know you know quite a bit about this. What is actually in this bill? What are the other? The forced vaccination is one of it.

Matt Wong 23:29
Oh, that’s not in this bill. That’s in WA’s.

Molly Knight 23:33
WA’s health bill? Yeah. Health?

Matt Wong 23:35
I think it’s in the current act. Yeah. We don’t have anything like that in Victoria.

Molly Knight 23:40
So what what’s in this omnibus bill, what what is actually in it?

Matt Wong 23:46
So I’m just pulling it up in front of me now. So what did you want to know about the the good, there’s a whole lot of good stuff, as you don’t know about that. Just, you know, the ability for courts to conduct things via zoom and all of that, you know, that’s all fine. The bad stuff you wanted to know about?

Molly Knight 24:01
I see. Well, that’s the stuff that scares people, but the stuff that takes away their freedoms and their rights as a human being. So yeah, let’s have a look at that.

Matt Wong 24:11
Just cut me off. If I’m I don’t know how long I’ve got to ask how long we’re interviewing for. So I don’t want to keep you too long. I’ve got plenty of time. But if you look at lay it all out. Okay. So if you look at the bill, which you can get from where would you get it from? I think it’s at Au, and it is called the covid 19 Omnibus emergency measures and other acts Amendment Bill 2020. It’s only 45 pages long and half of that is the explanatory memorandum, which I said was at the front of the bill. If you go down to page a COVID-19, temporary measures, which is down sort of thing, page 11 ish. Here we’re talking about for example, section 250 of the bill which is intending to add Section 30 into the act. So a new section 30. subsection one is going to say that the Secretary so the secretary of the HHS, by instrument, this is important. instrument means just a piece of paper that they sign. So in our country, we have x and then we have regulations, regulations are not voted on. And then legislative instruments which sit below, which is literally just a letter that someone signs. So the secretary by instrument may appoint any of the following to be an authorized officer. So these are the people who can exercise the emergency powers. This is the condition, a person the secretary considers appropriate for appointment based on the person’s skills, abilities, experience, or otherwise. And you know what other qualifications are listed or as required, it’s none. That’s it. So just the Secretary has to consider that they’re appropriate for appointment based on skills, attributes, experience or otherwise. Now, they said this is this is not an exaggeration. In the explanatory memorandum, if you scroll up to the top of that bill, it literally says that this new section 30, subsection one is intended to enable the HHS to appoint public servants to exercise these powers. If you think about these powers, we’re talking about significant powers, which are found in Section 200 of the public health and wellbeing act. They’re things like detaining people, and so on. Now, that is scary, because at the moment, we’re seeing big poll make a lot of errors, and they’re highly trained. We’re talking about people who are untrained, how many errors are they gonna make, but it goes on, there are more bad things that are sneaking in through this on the bus. We already have section 192 of the public health mobbing Act, which is allows people to assist anyone who’s exercising emergency powers to anyone, there’s no qualification on that. So if the law says currently now, if a let’s say a police officer is trying to detain someone under emergency powers, any other citizen any other human in here in this state can assist that officer. So the ability to recruit others. So now we’re talking about a public servant coming to your door with the help of I don’t know your neighbor, exercising some of these powers. Now, that’s scary enough, section 200 pounds is scary enough, they want to introduce a new section, this is called further emergency powers. This is a new section called section 200. A for apple. Further emergency powers say that a designated authorized officer which is now public servants, or whoever they want, may detain a person under Section 200. Which of those powers if a direction has been given in the exercise of emergency power, so just give a direction. And this is the key. The designated authorized officer reasonably believes that a person who is required to comply is a high risk person and is likely to refuse or fail to comply. So it’s saying that the officer has to make a prediction now that you are likely to refuse or failed to comply. And if you are likely to refuse or fail to comply, maybe someone like me, who’s on a podcast with Health Australia Party is likely or a fuse. I don’t know. It’s in the minds of that public servant, he comes to my door. They can detain me.

Molly Knight 28:17
So what does that mean when they detain you? Where do you go?

Matt Wong 28:21
It’s detainment and forcible removal. So they can put you in a facility like hotel quarantine. And to be fair to the government, they are saying that, look, there are some people with mental health issues or some people are so out there in terms of repeated offenses against the code of directions that they’re very high risk and likely to, to to disobey these orders. So we have to preemptively lock them up. Now, I don’t I mean, that’s ridiculous. That’s such a abrogation of liberties. But that’s what the government is saying. And I understand why they’re saying that. Yeah. And so detainment, okay, there is no limit. So there is no recourse to the courts, either. This is the huge thing. Usually when you detain someone, they can call them the courts to complain. There’s nothing left, perhaps maybe for the legal nerds out there. They could issue writs of habeas corpus, which is, you know, you can look that up, but it’s very unlikely. Overall, you’re stuck in there as long as the the authorised officer or the department does this to you. But keep in mind, there were the two conditions, right, they had to believe that you’re likely to disobey and you had to be a high risk person. And this bill defines a high risk person as someone with COVID-19 positive test results, or has had close contact with someone who has had a positive COVID-19 test result. So the effect of this bill is going to make tests go down. I mean, you think why the hell am I going to get tested for COVID-19 now and become a virus person?

Molly Knight 29:48
Yeah, exactly.

Matt Wong 29:49
I’m not gonna get tested. Why would I?

Molly Knight 29:51
Yeah, no, you wouldn’t, you wouldn’t put you at a higher risk.

Matt Wong 29:57
So that’s it. I mean, That’s the powers and and that’s what I can do. So overall, it’s pre emptive. Pre crime, it’s like minority report that the movement is it’s pre emptive detention based on a loosened standard of just predicting someone. And that prediction is now coming from a very diffuse and diverse, untrained, potentially untrained population.

Molly Knight 30:25
Hmm, yeah, it could be anyone could know. I mean, I don’t know. I just I don’t get it. I seriously don’t understand how any politician can say this is okay. No matter how deep a hole is dug for themselves. It just makes no sense.

Matt Wong 30:46
Well, look, I think it does if if

Can I read a quote to his place of you? Do you know CS Lewis? Well, he wrote nonie sorry. Oh, CS Lewis.

Molly Knight 31:01
Yep. Yep. Yeah.

Unknown Speaker 31:02
He’s written a lot of things besides Narnia. But just a short quote, which kind of sums it up. He says, All tyrannies a tyranny sincerely exercise for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive, it would be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. Because the robber barons cruelty may sometimes sleep he’s cupidity or greed May at some point be satiated. But those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end for they do so with the approval of their own conscience. And I think this is the big problem we’re facing and Victoria those who are for Dan for the lockdowns and for Dan and his friends, they truly believe they’re doing the right thing. And there’s no end to the destruction they’re causing because they’re doing it with the approval of their own conscience. And that is why lately I’ve been fighting by interviewing people, and publicizing them who who are focusing on the on the conscience side of things like why can’t we let our kids go back to school? Why is it okay that that couple drop their kids off to the grandparents killed themselves? But it’s better it’s it’s not okay that the 95 year old died? Why are we equivalent? equivocating live lives? Why is one life more important than another? Then? You tell us that we’re being like that you’re Why is it okay? It’s not it’s not okay. Why Jim, Jim’s mine was in here the other day interviewing. And he, he’s got franchisees who have literally now have no government support, because they’re on a bridging visa. They’re destitute, they have to go and live in his conference center, and they’re trying to feed this poor woman. You know why? Because she has a dog washing trailer, Jim’s dog washing, she’s not allowed to wash dogs by herself in the trailer. But if you own a dog washing store, like a shop front, you’re allowed to what the hell is that? Well, how about the council’s can mow the grass in groups, but franchisees of gyms who want to move by themselves, No, stay home and go broke?

Molly Knight 32:59
That’s insane. It is insane. See, it makes no sense. None of this is making sense.

Unknown Speaker 33:07
Look, I hate to be so negative, but i i think that we are we are seeing a fight come up against it. And I want to encourage people who are listening, what can you do? We talked about calling members and so on and, and asking questions and keeping your eyes open and looking at what’s happening in your own state. But we also need to think about the key opinion leaders the influences, they have been eerily quiet so much so that I’ve had huge businessman contact me from Australia, one of the biggest businesses in Australia has thousands of staff does hundreds of millions of dollars of revenue every year, totally supports us but can’t say a word. He says I can’t say anything in public because he’s industries quite left wing. And he just can’t afford to. It’s not even for him. He doesn’t he has staff. He doesn’t want to destroy the livelihoods of all this stuff. But we need we need you opinion leaders. We need you leaders to come out and have a rational discussion. Look, the COVID doctors were here they’re doing it. The q C’s are coming out. They’re doing it. The deputy Lord Mary interviewed in here he’s doing it of Melbourne. Other people need to come out not just the same humans who are out there saying, you know, he’s painted as crazy. Some human. We need the normal middle people to come out and say hey, I don’t want this anymore. Thank you.

Molly Knight 34:22
Yes. Yeah. enough’s enough. Yeah, I mean, it’s, it’s, um, I don’t like saying people hide behind. I just can’t do this. Because if everybody stood up and said, This is not right, let’s stick take a step back then it would end tomorrow. Even then. If everybody keeps saying, Oh, I can’t do this. And you know, I’ve got to be careful. Well, that okay, you’re stuck with what you’ve got time to speak up people.

Unknown Speaker 34:53
Let me be an encouragement to you as well. Do you know who I am? I’m a nobody. I’m not even a lawyer. And yet, everyone, thousands of 100 something thousand people are watching my breakdown of the omnibus bill. You know why? Because all the brighter minds out there haven’t been bothered to do it. And I’m actively yelling at them on LinkedIn saying, Come on, you guys are way smarter than me. Please speak like, do an explainer video on this law, you got probably going to find heaps of areas in mind because you’re a real lawyer, but no one’s doing it. If I can do I’ve got no following. You know, I just, I’m just trying to help. And I think a lot of people have expertise in health, like GPS, if you’re a GP come out and tell the stories of Hey, why can’t I prescribe my patient? hydroxychloroquine? I may be wrong, but maybe I should be allowed to try it. Why are you banning it? I’m gonna tell you stories, put a video up on Facebook. And if you need a platform, talk to me. When I have a TV show I have I have the ear of politicians, you know, will will if you got a good story, and you tell it well, we’ll make you famous.

Molly Knight 35:52
Mm hmm.

Yeah, it’s um, well, I just keep saying none of it makes sense. And I know certainly that there’s been a huge amount of advice given to government officials, particularly health ministers about ways that this could be dealt with in a safe manner for everyone. But they take no notice. No notice at all. It’s a no no, we need to you Out with the old and in with the new I think we need a bit of a turnaround. Yeah,

Matt Wong 36:25
well, I think what you hit on it, you know, don’t hide behind influences as I’m trying to tell you people look at me like I’m an influencer. I’m not. I’m normal. Like you guys. Come on. Everyone Speak up. Do you can do it legally, on your phone on Facebook. Please help me come out here and talk.

Molly Knight 36:42
Exactly. And I think too, I mean, if everybody comes out of their houses in Victoria, there aren’t enough police or Defence Force personnel to put them all away. So now you’re talking Hands up.

Matt Wong 36:55
Now you talk about civil disobedience which v Paul who are listening? I’m not suggesting a protest. Thank you, Paul. However, theoretically speaking people, if the BLM March happened to remember that there was 10,000 plus people in Melbourne March is 20 27,000 police officers throughout all of Victoria and what how many 66 point 8 million or something oversee there is no way they could stop mass civil disobedience. Now. I don’t think it’s going to happen. I don’t think Victorians have the stomach for it, as I’ve said. But the point is, why are we living in fear we are the voice of Victoria We are the power of Victoria we are we set the tone, not the Premier’s office and I say this over my videos. Don’t let him set the tone. And you know how you do that. When you’re at Woolworths people are stressed. If you’re at the supermarket, the only place we’re allowed to go once a day, you South Welshman you don’t get it, we’re only allowed to go out once a day one person for two hours. It’s when you’re at Woolworths, Hey, nice to the person in the queue in front of you. Like, you know, let’s let’s let’s take back the city that set the tone of this place. And then Andrews can go to hell with his fear and division in the press conferences. I just don’t listen to his fear anymore. And I think we’ll win that way.

Molly Knight 38:11
Mm hmm.

Yes, some speak up here. wherever you are. Speak out a little bit gently, though. civil disobedience. No, no. But do something. It’s time. People have to get together and they have to stand up. There’s no two ways about that.

Matt Wong 38:30
Oh we’re not allowed to get together.

Molly Knight 38:32
No, that’s right. You know, I think in New South Wales, it’s still a maximum of 20 people at certain things. But you know, weddings and funerals are different. I mean, you know, when you hear things like that, that is the common sense is gone. Because does the virus not go for people that are in isolation or small groups, but always there in big groups, but only if you’re in small group? I mean, it’s, it’s all back to front. We should

Matt Wong 39:06
lvrs is very intelligent Molly. It is nocturnal. It comes out at it used to come out at 8:01pm but as of a week ago, comes at at 901 pm. That’s why we will have to huddle into our homes at 9pm.

Molly Knight 39:19
Yeah, it’s very clever and won’t cross those borders. Yeah. It’s very good. When

Matt Wong 39:26
we make fun, but I’ve had the doctors in here showing me the stats that cases aren’t dead exploding Victorian, a second wave, yes. But deaths did not. Somehow the virus is really struggling to kill us. And that’s not taking away from the people who have tragically died. Like they do all the time. People don’t all the time. My first career was in medicine. I had a medical clinic for nine years. I’m very familiar with death. I hated seeing my patients died very young ages. But coronavirus, as you said it’s similar to the flu. I put the stats I’ve seen it’s a little bit worse than the flu, but it’s certainly not Nothing like a real nothing like the Spanish flu. And it certainly deaths. You know why we switched from measuring tests to cases because the deaths aren’t there anymore.

Molly Knight 40:10
It’s a mess. It is a mess. It’s some people have just been badly lied to. hoodwinked. Yeah, it’s very sad. Very sad. Okay. Is there anything else you could suggest, Matt that could help people move through this a little bit easier so that the fear dissolves a little bit for Victorians

Matt Wong 40:41

Molly Knight 40:43
Well, for everybody really. But Victoria is a tragic at the moment. It’s I think it’s, I mean, it’s almost it’s so serious that people just don’t understand what’s really being done. I think, in fact, I saw a photo today come through a feed of a big camera, two cameras on light poles with loudspeakers. And apparently, they’re on every corner in the CBD in Melbourne. I mean, I have no way to verify that. But that’s what came through on this feed with a photo of these great big box

Matt Wong 41:22
cameras, facial recognition cameras, do you mean?

Molly Knight 41:26
Well, I guess it would be Yeah. I mean, I don’t actually have a problem with cameras. Because, you know, I think, you know, it’s good. You can get the crooks and you can follow people a bit. And but I think having lat Why have they got loudspeakers on them? That makes no sense. Why do you need loudspeakers? And there’s two cameras, a big one at the top and one on the box. So what is that all about? And are they on every street corner?

Matt Wong 41:52
No, they’re not. I’ve seen that picture on social media and I was in the CBD. For a week and a half ago, I traveled all over for work still. And I’m not seeing those. I’m just, I wish I was so I can tell you. It’s terrible. But I’m not saying those. I’m not seeing those errors. Yeah, yeah, I think we have to be careful, everyone, because we all want to find and doing the wrong thing. And he’s doing plenty wrong. Okay? So let’s crucify him for what he’s doing wrong. Do not make up stuff. Because if you make up stuff, no one’s gonna believe us when we point what he is doing wrong. So please just focus on what’s actually verified. There’s plenty of it. Plenty of us.

Molly Knight 42:29
Well, it’s very hard to get verification when people aren’t allowed out more than five kilometers. And, you know, it’s hard to get that verification, I guess. But, you know, obviously, that’s real light camera, and they were around somewhere on

Matt Wong 42:44
Yes, of course, somewhere. But that really goes to your point about hey, what can we do to dissolve the fear? I think, you know, if you go outside now in Melbourne, and you have I asked someone in the interview before this one, how many police have you seen when you go out shopping to check your mask? None? In the whole two months of lockdown? None. Why do you wear your mask then? Is it because you think it’s like say like health reasons? No. Why I don’t get fine, but you never see any police and they Oh, so the thing is place, place rule. This theory by Jeremy Bentham called the panopticon, I won’t go too deep into it, it might be a bit long, but just the idea of being afraid of being caught jumping at shadows. And Dan is relying on this. Now if you look at his press conferences, I was a big believer in him. And I was trying to defend him and support him just on a human level, not on a policy level. But he’s gone so far now where the way he treats us is more akin to an abuser relationship. And he’s starting to really use fear to divide us. And I think we have to be careful not to allow ourselves to get into that fear, even when we’re fighting him. Because then he’s still winning. We have to make sure when I say let’s let’s stand together as Victorians and I made a video called I don’t stand with Dan, I stand with Victoria. The reason is, I don’t think I think he would be most annoyed if we were not afraid of him, or of the virus. I think if we were to come against them and say you’re an idiot, Dan, and I don’t think that would hurt him at all. But I think what would really hurt Dan, is if we got on with our lives, if we were mature, if we were happy. I mean happy in the sense that we just refuse to have his fear within hope. And we started to treat each other well. I think that would piss him off no end. Because I think what you’d start to see your society start to function. little bits of disobedience would happen here and there. Like when I took my daughter to the swing across the road in a quiet suburban neighborhood illegally, I might add a push to on the swing, stuff like that. We’re starting to see sparks of hope within the community by being a bit more more hopeful. So that’s this dissolve the fear. Remember that he doesn’t set what Victoria is I know it looks like that. But he can’t actually control us as much as he’s trying to at the end of the day. You know, there’s a quote by learned Hayes, I think his name was he was a justice, a judge in the US and he said, Liberty lies within the hearts of men and women and no constitution, no law, and no police. Nothing can can revive it when it dies there and in the same way, no constitution, no lawn. No, no executive can kill it when it lives there. So we need to make sure that we remember that we have we have that power.

Molly Knight 45:31
Hmm. Yeah, that’s, that’s lovely. Yeah, we do have the power. That’s right. Okay, Matt, thank you. That’s been really interesting. And I really enjoy your balanced approach. Thank you. It’s, um, it’s great. What What is your website, Matt, so people can go and have a look and follow you

Matt Wong 45:54
probably just had to discernible is. There’s two ways of spelling discernible for some reason I chose that a virgin. So just discern and enable. I’m on Facebook, Twitter, not Facebook, LinkedIn, YouTube, Instagram. But yeah, I have a TV show as well, which is cool that I post on there with. It’s called What’s it called? Not? It was called not the project is I think I already told you. We’re trying to fight the project. We have we’ve renamed it to the people’s project. But we have people on like, we have Craig Kelly on Friday, and we have all the COVID doctors on we have just incredible people. You can find me there. And hey, thank you so much, Molly, for having me on. I hope it helped someone out there.

Molly Knight 46:37
Yeah, I’m pretty sure it will, Matt, it’s certainly your balanced approach. I think he’s very calming. I found it calming. And, you know, it’s good to know that. You know, like, when I saw that photo of the camera with the loudspeakers, I just went back and said, Can this be verified? Please? Nobody gets back to me. So it’s, I guess, people perhaps like, they just put stuff out there and then move on to the next thing. So you’re left sort of going, Is this real? Is it not real? How do we respond? Do we do anything? Do we do nothing? So

Matt Wong 47:14
it’s like the children thing they can take your children think that? Yeah, that’s been misrepresented.

Molly Knight 47:20
Hmm. Yeah. So they they won’t just come into your house and take your kids less? Yeah. I mean, you can understand if there’s a serious reason, I can understand that at any time. Children need to be safe. But yeah, yeah. So thank you for your balanced approach methods. It’s been wonderful and your information is enormously valuable. Thank you. Thank you for coming on. Nice.

Matt Wong 47:46
Thank you. My pleasure.

Molly Knight 47:47
Thank you. Good night, everyone. Thank you for joining us, and I hope you’ve gained as much from this talk as I certainly have. And yeah, thank you. Stay, stay well. stay aware and awake, and let’s get our country back on to a good economic and healthy footing. Good night, everyone.



Victorians are under one of the world’s toughest long term restrictions with no reprieve in sight, based on flawed computer modelling, a ‘roadmap’ that is tunnel visioned and is not backed by scientific evidence. The Victorian State Government cannot be allowed to continue with its present leadership. The damage to the State and all citizens is catastrophic.

The HAP is calling for three primary actions:

  1. For the Victorian ALP to remove Daniel Andrews as Premier immediately
  2. The immediate revision of the unrealistic roadmap including a reduction of targets/restrictions which are not back by science
  3. An immediate full independent investigation into Daniel Andrews leadership over the Covid19 response and the integrity of the ALP Government under Daniel Andrews.

Important questions need to be asked of Daniel Andrews leadership and decision making during the State Government’s COVID19 response. Wider questions of his party’s activities now also warrant investigation, especially with regards to the dealings around the Chinese ‘Belt and Road Initiative’.

Questions asked should include:


  • Has Daniel Andrews considered advice from a wide range of experts concerning the impacts of the restrictions?
  • Why has Daniel Andrews not explored the use of evidence-based treatments including natural medicines that they are being used successfully in the COVID19 response throughout the world?
  • Is Daniel Andrews roadmap contingent on unrealistic targets that are not applied anywhere else in Australia and possibly the world?
  • Have there been statistical errors and/or manipulation to justify the aggressive lock downs imposed on Victorians?
  • Did Daniel Andrews choose a security company for hotel quarantine arrangements based upon vested interests or identity politics rather than competency for the task?
  • Why has Daniel Andrews stated that the roadmap is not an elimination strategy and that an elimination strategy is not appropriate, yet his roadmap requires 14 days with zero cases across the state?
  • Why did he refuse ADF assistance and subsequently lie about this to the inquiry?
  • Why is Daniel Andrews mandating a curfew that was not recommended by the Chief Health Officer Professor Brett Sutton or the Police Commissioner Shane Patton?
  • Are the growing instances of police heavy-handedness being driven by the government?
  • Were deals done with minor parties to pass the State of Emergency extension that may have circumvented the democratic process?


  • Did ‘Belt and Road Initiative’ lobbyist Jean Dong receive over $36,000 in payments from the Victorian Government?
  • How is the Daniel Andrews Government able to sign a ‘Belt and Road Initiative’ agreement without Federal approval?
  • What is the extent of branch stacking in the state ALP and have all people involved been identified and dealt with appropriately?
  • Are the party’s financial dealings all above board?

The time has come where we must ask ourselves whether the cure is worse than the disease.

We now implore all Victorians to write to their MPs and demand action – we’ve made it easy.



The HAP is seeking feedback to determine whether media accounts of approval ratings for Daniel Andrews are accurate. Provide your responses below so that the unbiased views of Victorians can truly be represented.


  • It would help to know that you are actually a human.
Judy Wilyman PhD joined us Thursday September 17 on Facebook Live to discuss the responses of Governments in Australia to Covid-19. In her live discussion with Molly Knight she covered :
  • unscientific restrictions
  • flawed medical testing
  • conflicts of interest in government advisory panels
  • the Covid-19 vaccine chosen for Australians



Judy became interested in the vaccination topic in 1993 after vaccinating her first child. She began studying the safety, efficacy and necessity for each vaccine on the schedule and in 2015 completed a PhD at the University of Wollongong. Her thesis was titled ‘A critical analysis of the Australian Government’s rationale for its vaccination policy’ in which she presents information on the claims made by the Government about vaccines that are not supported by scientific evidence. Her book based on her PhD research titled ‘Australia’s Loss of Health Freedom’ is now available to buy.

Click on the image below to watch the full interview:


The complete transcript follows – E&OE :

Molly Knight 0:04
Welcome to Health Australia Party Thursday night Talk. Thank you for joining us. Tonight we’ve got a cracker of a talk. And I’ll be introducing Dr. Judy wildermann. In just a minute. What? Excuse me, what I wanted to do is just to start tonight by reading you something that Health Australia Party has launched, it’s something pretty special. And we’ve asked for three primary actions for the Victorian Alp to remove Daniel Andrews as premier immediately the immediate revision of the unrealistic roadmap including a reduction of targets and restrictions, which are not backed by science and an immediate full independent investigation into Daniel Andrews leadership over the COVID-19 response and the integrity of the Alp government under Daniel Andrews, so please Go to the Health Australia Party web page and look at this action and take part in it Victorians. You need to stand up now. Okay, so tonight we’ll be I’ll be talking with Dr. Judy wildermann. Judy has a Bachelor of Science degree and a Masters of Science. So she’s got a great science background Remember that? And she practiced as a science teacher for 20 years. In 2015, Judy completed her PhD through the Willingham University. The thesis is titled, a critical analysis of the Australian Government’s rationale for its vaccination policy. Yes, and it provides scientific arguments showing that the government’s shedule of vaccines is the most likely cause of the chronic illnesses that are so rampant in our children today and Also, it’s implemented in the many deaths that we’re observing in children today. It’s very, very important work. And I must tell you too, that Judy’s thesis, which is available on her web page has been downloaded over 28,000 times. Now I’ve got to tell you, nobody reads thesis is because they often very long and boring but 28,000 downloads. That’s awesome. So tonight, we’re going to look at a few issues with us. She’ll discuss the unscientific restrictions and the flawed medical testing. That were the excesses and the many, many conflicts of interest in government advisory panel. That’s huge to discuss the COVID-19 vaccine chosen for Australians. And also, we’ll talk about the government vaccine sheduled linked to the chronic illness and Importantly, the undone science in government claims of safety and efficacy of vaccines. It’s back to it is a big topic. It’s controversial. it ignites many emotions in people. So please feel free to ask any questions that you have. And after our discussion, I can put the questions to Judy. So with enormous pleasure, I welcome Dr. Judy wildermann. Judy, thank you so much for joining us.

Dr Judy Wilyman 3:31
No problem, Molly. It’s lovely to be here. Thank you,

Molly Knight 3:35
Judy. I’d like to start off tonight by asking you about your journey up to and through your PhD. How did you come to consider your topic for the PhD? And what yet just your journey there because I know it’s been quite a journey and there’s been a lot of ups and downs for you. And having to change. What do you call it at universities from one house to another? Just to do like the back of one thing? Yeah. Yeah, one thing leads to another because of politics. I guess that’s fair, isn’t it? So can you start there and tell us what led you to do this work? And yeah, just your journey, Judy, please. Yes, yes.

Dr Judy Wilyman 4:25
Well, I guess the bottom line is I was teaching in the schools at an interesting time in history. So in fact, I started teaching in 1996. So I was there pre the expansion of the government’s vaccination program so and then happened in 1990. Many, many of you will know that. In 1996, Ronald Reagan in the US passed the act which removed all liability from pharmaceutical companies with reference to the harm that they can they cause in individuals. And so once that liability was removed, because prior to that prior to 1986, there were so many Vaccine Injury claims that the vaccine companies were saying, well, we can’t go on producing vaccines if we’re gonna have to pay all this liability. So they fixed that problem through politics and liability was removed in 1996. And with that, by 1990, we started to see many more vaccines being added to the schedule. And, and, you know, during that time I was teaching in the schools. And so, and at the same time, as the vaccines were being added to the country, indications to vaccines started to be reduced. So all that family history and knowledge of, you know, families that have genes that make them predisposed to say allergies or anaphylaxis, more Have neurological damage. Those contraindications were gradually removed and narrowed right up until 2016 when they mandated vaccines and reduced all of them completely, except for anaphylaxis. So the interesting thing is separately prior to 1990, we didn’t have this autism, this ADHD, the anaphylaxis in the schools, you know, the seizures, convulsions, etc. All of which I will emphasize is listed on the package inserts for vaccines as side effects to vaccines. So it wasn’t unknown. And medical in the medical profession knew that. You know, some people are predisposed to them. But without parents knowledge, the vaccines were added to the schedule and throughout so through the 90s you know, I was just amazed at the principals were sitting around discussing, well, you know, what’s causing all this autism what’s causing this ADHD. And, you know, I started having children in 1993. So that’s when I was exposed to that the expansion in the program, the number of vaccines had already started to double. And you know, that the chronic illness skyrocketed through the 90s, literally. So by 2008, the chronic illness had increased fivefold. And in schools, we now have pictures of students in the staff, who Anna electic. So we had to be able to identify them in the playground and be aware that even the smell of peanut butter could cause this electric shock, which in some cases is fatal.

Molly Knight 7:49
And exactly yeah,

Dr Judy Wilyman 7:50
these are life threatening conditions, and many of them actually prevent children reaching their potential in life and in the case of autism, and You know, many other neurological disabilities, parents have become long term carriers for these children with seizures and convulsions. And when we asked the government even at that time through the 90s and the early 2000s, they asked the government, you know, have you investigated that link between the 12 to 16 vaccines that were being recommended for infants from day one of life, and that increase in chronic illness? They said, Oh, no, no, that’s just a coincidence. And of course, that’s there’s the key. You need systematic evidence based medicine requires systematic investigation of causal factors. And the one factor they have always removed when they’ve looked at the increase in chronic chronic illness, and environmental factors that could be causing it. I’ve always left out the vaccination program which injects chemicals goes directly into the bloodstream and tissues of the body. So that’s that’s the key. That’s where I started and I became very intrigued to find out what was in a vaccine that is being injected into every tissue of the infant that is developing.

Molly Knight 9:16
Yes, it’s a, it’s, um, well, I think it’s a disgrace that the science isn’t done and that they have no liability. I mean, as a health practitioner, if I break someone’s nail, I’m in trouble. But he they can inject these things cause seizures, anaphylaxis and add autism. That’s right and nothing nothing.

Dr Judy Wilyman 9:42
And parents are simply dismissed as even when they know that this has been caused by the vaccine. The doctors will dismiss it as anecdotal evidence and just a coincidence, you know, and then they’ll dismiss parents who want the As anti vaxxers and and label people it is and, you know, so disrespectful to parents who are the ones that actually know their children the best and who want evidence based medicine be behind this. So false and misleading information has been presented in the media and by governments. Yes, you know, to hide this fact that the correlation has never been investigated.

Molly Knight 10:29
It’s quite tragic. It’s some, I actually don’t know anyone who’s just an anti vaxxer. Because the question vaccines have usually got a very valid reason for becoming a little bit cautious about

Dr Judy Wilyman 10:44
what parent wouldn’t be against vaccines if they were safe and effective and that the evidence was provided. There is no It makes no sense. And on top of that, the government has been doubly disrespectful because they Then promote vaccines, such as the hipping cough vaccine on anecdotal evidence, which is a parent Whose child is, you know, claimed to have been died of say he’d been called for another disease. But often there’s no evidence of, you know, how they’ve died. The context of that death is all is never presented. But the very fact that you can promote vaccines on anecdotal evidence, but then suppress the anecdotal evidence of the harm that vaccines are causing. I mean, that is criminal. It really is and parents need to be angry about this

Molly Knight 11:39
is quite a great, a quite a great, we just need the truth. So tell me, let’s go back to your PhD. So you became interested having children and looking at what’s in them. So tell me about the journey to get permission to do your Ph. D. PhD.

Dr Judy Wilyman 11:59
Yes. I did, I decided that I should be the master of science first in population health. So I enrolled in the public health School of Public Health in the Faculty of Health. Because I, you know, I thought, well, I’ll just test the waters to see if there is a problem here, you know, I had started vaccinating my children. So I wanted to know that I was doing the right thing. And, you know, just that was only a possibility that the vaccines could be the cause. At so I completed the Masters of Science with a major project on the whooping cough vaccine and the government’s policy, which wasn’t matching the evidence that I’ve found in the thesis. So but that thesis got a high distinction from the academics and I decided that I would like to continue that research with a PhD. But the Faculty of Health decided they wouldn’t provide supervisors for that project investigating and the role of vaccines in Controlling infectious diseases, they decided that it was better suited to the social sciences and in the Faculty of Arts

Molly Knight 13:12
and rather strange decision really isn’t being a health issue.

Dr Judy Wilyman 13:16
Well, that’s right. It’s a health issue. And in fact, see, here’s the key. infectious diseases were controlled through political and economic decisions that control the environment made changes to the environment and lifestyle factors. Because infectious agents are not independent causes of disease. They’re more virulent, if there’s environmental factors or host characteristics when your body’s rundown and stressed and psychological factors. All of these things come into how serious a disease will be in any person if they’re infected with the virus. And, of course, it’s technically termed social medicine. infectious diseases, you know, throughout the 1900s was always under the umbrella of social medicine, which is your public health or mental health. But the health aspect that doesn’t require medications to control infectious diseases by 1950 in Australia, all of the infectious diseases had been controlled deaths were very, very rare in children to to the childhood diseases, and in fact, they took measles whooping cough and influenza off the national notifiable disease list in 1950. So more I think that the, the deaths and illnesses to infectious diseases declined at simultaneously to the improvements in sanitation, hygiene, nutrition, big factor Smaller family sizes. So by 1950 children weren’t dying of these infectious diseases, none of them, none of us, none of them. And there were still cases of these diseases, but they were mild and mostly asymptomatic. in developed countries, you see, a as well,

Molly Knight 15:21
exactly the

Dr Judy Wilyman 15:23
herd immunity creating herd immunity. They that’s where the asymptomatic cases came in, and they’re critical to developing herd immunity. They are not a threat in a developed country, because people that get infected in a developed country 99% of them will be either asymptomatic or very mild symptoms, and that goes for covid and influenza infections as well. This is why it is unscientific to even consider locking down a healthy population before let me say before You’ve even experienced that Mars under your own environmental conditions and host characteristics. And in countries which have differing quality of health care systems. Hmm.

Molly Knight 16:14
Makes no sense. Does it make no

Dr Judy Wilyman 16:16
sense whatsoever and so from 19 from throughout the 1900s, we’ve always controlled infectious diseases by isolating the sick people, you isolate the sick people. And then in serious cases, you could contact the trace, do trace contacting, so any of their, their contacts, that you can trace those and if they’re sick, then you would isolate those or you know, but that’s in very serious cases to isolate any healthy person that has no symptoms. And I will make the point that Scott Morrison and he tries a game was not Applying for the emergency powers on a pandemic of a novel virus new influenza virus. I mean Corona viruses mutate every year, and the first cases of coronavirus were in like December. And Scott Morrison applied for emergency powers to shut down the country on the 25th of January. Now why was he even thinking that new mutated Coronavirus, what would be a problem in Australia? We don’t get pandemics. They’re not pandemics natural pandemics unlikely in developed countries after 1950. So yes, you might get an outbreak of a disease but you need to go through the appropriate steps before you lock down a healthy population and make them sick up with every directive that was brought in by this government. Yes, there’s nothing that makes sense about you know, the measures that have been applied. To this outbreak of disease, which didn’t even hadn’t even reached Australia, when the government was applying for the emergency powers,

Molly Knight 18:10
definitely makes no sense, does it?

Dr Judy Wilyman 18:13
It doesn’t. And I will even point out that in that article, it was an article in The Sydney Morning Herald, and it was published on the 25th of February. And it actually states in the article that Scott Morrison was applying for the emergency powers. Even though a possible outcome at that time was that this virus would turn out to be a nose no stronger than a normal influenza virus. It’s actually stated in the article. So there were three possible outcomes and give us applying for emergency powers that led us into a police state that closed our borders and damaged businesses. There is no sense in that whatsoever and real questions need to be asked. Absolutely. Because in February, the the World Health Organization hadn’t even assessed the human to human transmission of that virus. They didn’t make that call till the 11th of March. But of course, if you apply for the emergency powers on the 21st of January, then they can be enacted as soon as it’s called on the 11th of March. And I will point out that on the 19th of March, the UK public health unit, downgraded that virus, and said it was it was no longer considered a virus of high consequence in the population, and it was not transmitting any more quickly than other influenza viruses. That was on the 19th of March, one week after the who had declared this this global pandemic, when, you know, the virus hadn’t even entered many countries when that statement was made.

Molly Knight 19:58
Well, clearly, there’s a deeper agenda it plays a bit because there is yes. Yeah. It’s, um, it’s disappointing that we’re being manipulated and run for deeper agendas that we aren’t told about that. As human beings, we don’t have this freedom of information that I know it’s been applied for. And people just get locked out. They can’t, will not release any information on the numbers, the true numbers

Dr Judy Wilyman 20:34
in the Gazette. And, you know, very interesting point was when someone applied through the Freedom of Information Act, to get for the government to provide a test that 100% proves that the SIRs Cove to virus is actually being identified in any of these deaths or cases that are being reported. So kind of specifically, I do To find that virus, the answer was no relevant documents have been found. And this is, again, a very serious point because we know that the PCR tests and the antibody tests are not diagnostic tools for that specific virus. The PCR test is not a licensed diagnostic tool anyway. And therefore, it cannot be used to identify the virus and said we don’t have any proof of causality here. That is critical to determine, you know, to declaring a global pandemic you need proof of causality. Before you make that statement, and, you know, I can see clearly how they have created the pandemic. Because in my thesis, I researched the swine flu vaccine, the swine flu pandemic of 2009 That’s where a lot of this, they’ve copied the same format. But but one big thing that happened in 2009 was that the World Health Organization changed the definition of a pandemic. You see, they couldn’t have called a global pandemic, either in 2009, or 2020. If they hadn’t changed the definition because a pandemic is when you see deaths and illnesses in the community. Everywhere you can see those deaths and illnesses in the community enormous numbers of deaths and illnesses. It’s not just an epidemic, it’s a pandemic. But what they was in 2009 was they removed that clause, they didn’t need to be enormous numbers of deaths and illnesses in the community anymore. It only needed to be increased numbers of that disease. But many of those increased numbers are non serious cases of disease in a developed country, flu and here, we’re talking about a few flu like virus, you know, flu like symptoms? Yes. So yes, it just sticks up. There’s a lot of things hidden in statistics, particularly disease statistics. And that’s what’s happened here. The government has been using fraudulent statistics in that this PCR test is not a licensed diagnostic tool, it cannot identify a whole virus and say that that virus was present in those cases, it only it only identifies segments of a virus, and in this case, segments of RNA, so the genome of that virus, but but not the whole virus, so and because there’s this other related viruses and so,

Molly Knight 23:46
yes, there are many Corona viruses, aren’t there many

Dr Judy Wilyman 23:50
family of Corona viruses and 40% of the population will have been exposed to those because they cause the common cold. So that said, I swear The antibody test again, is not going to tell you anything about whether you’ve got COVID, it can tell you that you may have some immunity to coronaviruses because your antibody tied to it to those viruses is raised. But it can’t tell you if you’ve got an active case of COVID. Or even if it was SAS code two, it’s not specific enough to do that. So there’s reports of cases, people need to ask what was the definition of a case that they were reporting, many of these cases didn’t have any disease symptoms. So that is so fraudulent because Healthy People shouldn’t be considered cases of disease. And in some cases, the cases might have had flu like symptoms or cough or sneeze. But either way, we weren’t told about the context of the cases that were being reported to frighten people about this virus that had already been downgraded from a high consequence infectious disease. And clearly in the community, we weren’t seeing these enormous deaths. And so it is fraudulent reporting and fraudulent to use this, these tests and that the Premier’s and government can be liable, personally liable under civil rights law for that sort of reporting.

Molly Knight 25:23
And they need to be called on it because growing our economy destroys reserves, and

Dr Judy Wilyman 25:29
they’re removing our right to control how we treat our own bodies, what we inject into our own bodies, even using a mask, it’s invasive, and it is causing ill health in a large number of people. The studies are very clear, and and healthy people should not be getting medically tested. That’s invasive. It’s an invasive test and we have a right to control our own bodies and this is protected under all the international health covenants. People do need to resist. And, you know, we’ve got to stop complying with these directives.

Molly Knight 26:08
Yes, exactly. And I think people need to remember that government officials work for us. They are our employees, basically. And they need to do the right things for us for our betterment, not for big corporations and their mates out there. So I think many members of parliament and politicians absolutely forget what they’re there for and why they’re there.

Dr Judy Wilyman 26:36
I think that’s a very good point. And I have watched over the last decade, as the public his voice was removed from government policy. And, and that was, in fact it’s happened over at least since 2005. Because that’s when the International Health Regulations were designed by the corporate partners in the Global Alliance for vaccines and immunization that GAVI Alliance, so those corporate partners, which include the Federation of pharmaceutical companies, as well as the International Monetary Fund and the World Bank, and, of course, the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, the Rockefeller Foundation. Exactly. I designed the introduction, influence in designing the International Health Regulations that the World Health Organization then required all member countries to sign up to. But that was done without the public’s knowledge or consultation.

Molly Knight 27:35
Exactly. And it mustn’t be done that way. We, we need to take back our power.

Dr Judy Wilyman 27:40
Well, I’m sorry.

That simple signing of that up to the International Health Regulations through the World Health Organization, we lost our sovereignty then, and that allowed corporations to then control our government and the directives that were put in place once the The World Health Organization called declared a global pandemic. And so, you know, the corporations are controlling these governments. Yes, yes, changes to our political system, we can get our voice back in the government, but it’s been removed from the media in these public debates. And I have been suppressed and censored for the last decade, this academic research, and there’s so much money and greasing the wheels so that people wouldn’t need to keep their jobs and hence, they’re not speaking up in support of freedom of academic speech and the right for me to give my research in Council venues. You know, the Lord Mayor of Sydney in 2017. You know, there was a big article in the media saying that, you know, I shouldn’t we shouldn’t be advertising my talk. On the the city of Sydney’s web page, and I got notification from some council venues that I was not allowed to present my academic research because it was simply by dismissing it as anti vaccination research. And people have accepted that label not understanding that that is the public interest in vaccination policy, the risks of vaccines, and how does that compare to the benefits of vaccines? See, that’s the other side of it. What proof has the government provided that vaccines actually control these diseases? That’s what I looked at in my PhD. And the government has not provided the statistics of the backs of number of vaccinated and unvaccinated cases of the these diseases that we get every year. Now that would prove categorically how effective the vaccine was. No Time has those two To explain us to support vaccination policy. And to add to that, and the government’s, the the I have a quote from the chairman of our vaccine advisory board that states that the Australian Government, you do not they do not need to prove that a vaccine can create herd immunity in the population before that vaccine is listed on the program. So, we have a government that says, since we have a government that promotes vaccines by making people feel guilty about community herd immunity, you must vaccinate for the sake of the community. Yet those vaccines do not have to be demonstrated to prove herd immunity before they are listed on that on that schedule. And there is no proof because they won’t use those statistics, statistics that are important in other cases of a disease let’s say measles or chickenpox that are hospitalized or all that People die of that disease. So if you looked at how many vaccinated people were dying or being hospitalized with measles or chicken pox and you looked at how many unvaccinated were getting those diseases and of course you could find out how effective the vaccine is. And what we what my thesis did show was that many highly vaccinated communities, we’ve got a 90 to 95% vaccination rate. I still getting outbreaks of these diseases and they’re in the vaccinated children.

Molly Knight 31:34
Hmm, yes, this is the measles. Yeah,

Dr Judy Wilyman 31:37
that’s right. We need to start demanding this evidence before any mandatory vaccinations come in. Man already Australia has gone too far down this road, but that’s simply because the media has not given us a voice the parents have voice in this debate, and nor have the official channels at the university. I there are many strategies they’ve used to suppress my research. For the universities and, you know, organizations that put on these conferences and select out certain, you know, perspectives of risk and benefit of these procedures.

Molly Knight 32:15
Well, it’s very big business, isn’t it? Very big business. The vaccination business. Yeah. What about the conflict of interest, Judy, in government advisory panels or committees? Can you talk a bit about that?

Dr Judy Wilyman 32:31
Yes. You realize I studied the conflicts of interest right up to 2015. And, you know, it’s, it’s incredible what conflicts exist. The majority of advisors on these boards have financial links to the vaccine companies. And through the 90s, right up until 2015. Chairman of the attention vaccine advisory Report Terry Nolan. He started in 1990 at the Murdoch Children’s Research Institute. And he in that time, he set up a program called Virgo, which is the largest research and development program for vaccines in Australia. And that was 1990. And then in 2005, he left that job at the Murdoch Children’s Research Institute to become the chairman of our vaccine advisory board to the government of tachy, the Australian Technical Advisory Group on Immunization and he was the chairman of that body for 10 years. As chairman, he was required to report to recommend vaccines directly to the health minister. And so he did that for 10 years. And he also had a second role during that decade. He was the deputy chair of the National Health and Medical Research Council. And as Deputy Chair he was involved In influencing decisions on funding for research, and if you remove funding from a particular area of research, then you don’t have the evidence to act with me. You don’t have the empirical hard evidence to say vaccines are safe or effective. If you don’t do that actual evidence, you can make those claims without the evidence. And that’s what’s happened here. The empirical causal study of vaccinated unvaccinated children has never been done. And they don’t use an inert placebo in the unvaccinated group and look at long term health effects of these 12 to 16 vaccines combined in an infant never been done. The placebo that’s often used is another vaccine. You know, so if you’re

Molly Knight 34:52
less doesn’t make sense, does it?

Dr Judy Wilyman 34:53
Well, if you can’t call that a safety study, if you don’t have the vaccine to see how that performs against the new vaccine. Well, that’s not a safety study. That’s a study to compare vaccines. Yes. But those are the the medical industry is claiming those to be safety studies. And again, that’s fraudulent. Hmm. And I think that has happened with this AstraZeneca COVID vaccine. I believe that they used a meningococcal vaccine as the placebo in the unvaccinated group. You know, it’s all very well to declare that but you’re not doing a safety study if you’re using the meningococcal vaccine as a placebo because the mustn’t have any effect on the body. And we know vaccines have neurological damage caused neurological damage. It is well documented. And you know, and willingboro syndrome causes seizures, convulsions, you know, meningitis they’re all listed as side effects on the package. source has been for decades.

Molly Knight 36:03
And they’re only listed there because they are, excuse me, known effects, they’re known effects of these axes. That’s why

Dr Judy Wilyman 36:10
they listed and salutely. And to say it’s just a coincidence, parents are actually being told by doctors Oh, that’s just a coincidence. And even the head of the vaccination program, Peter McIntosh, who was there from 1997 until 2000, and December 2017. And he was happy to just say all but correlation doesn’t equal causality without acknowledging that a correlation is a strong indicator of causality. And it’s a relationship that needs to be investigated if you’re claiming to use evidence based medicine. And this is a very sad fact and but the media allows them to get away with it. They haven’t made these government officials accountable for this topic. See, and it is the parents that have been smeared, our reputations destroyed. And this happens on Wikipedia. It happens in all mainstream medium. And if anyone listening wants to understand how that has happened, the pandemic movie, part two, called indoctrination, describes how this has happened and how the media is now singing from the same corporate songbook, with Wikipedia through the funding arrangements, you know, the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation pretty well funds, you know, as it has funding in every institution, they have front organizations to hide some of the links. Yes, yeah, deeply involved, do it. And of course, you know, we’ve always known that if the media doesn’t report on it, then of course, it Doesn’t happen, you know? Yes, you don’t hear about it, and hence you’ve got this false reality. And the media is creating a false reality about vaccines, because they’re just not reporting the other side of this debate, and, and the very real risks and lack of benefit of many of these vaccines. Hmm.

Molly Knight 38:20
Yes. I mean, it would be wonderful if we could have the proof that vaccines do what they claims, and I don’t think anybody would quibble or not want to take a vaccine, if it was proven that it doesn’t cause any ill effects. But that’s just not how it is.

Dr Judy Wilyman 38:41
No, no, and they they literally haven’t done the empirical science that would prove safety and efficacy. I mean, a lot. One other thing that people probably don’t know is that even with the efficacy of vaccines, they don’t they don’t demonstrate The vaccine can prevent the disease in people, they use a surrogate endpoint, which is antibody titer. But our immune systems are much more complex than just antibody titer. And this is well known and Stanley Plotkin, the father of vaccinology stated himself that they don’t know what is a reasonable measure for, you know, antibody titer to protect against the measles infection, for example. And that goes with many other vaccines as well. Often people with a high antibody titer still get the disease and people with a low antibody todich can be protected from disease. So it’s not a direct relationship. And people need to know that there’s more to the immune system than just antibody titer. Yet, that’s all a vaccine does is raise the antibody titer and that endpoint is not sufficient to form proof that the back saints are effective in preventing the disease in people. And, you know, people just need to remember that the vaccines weren’t used to control the disease in terms of reducing deaths and serious illness that was done prior to the majority of these vaccines being used. So there is no justification for any mandatory vaccine. The only question for people is which vaccines do they want to use? But that needs to be a voluntary choice? Yes. There’s no suggestion that you’re putting the community at risk if you don’t have a vaccine, because the government hasn’t provided evidence that a vaccine can even cause herd immunity. You know, and we know that they weren’t needed to control the deaths because the deaths were reduced through changes to the environment. You know, environmental changes our lifestyle and nutrition and boosting our Constitution. So we were stronger in the virulence of these infections declined without The vaccines?

Molly Knight 41:01
Yeah. And that’s all graphed, isn’t it on is that the Department of Health’s webpage that they’ve got all these figures and graphs? And you can you can see clearly how these diseases had well and truly declined by about the 50s, wasn’t it? Because I mean, I grew up and

Dr Judy Wilyman 41:17
really by the 50s, it was 950 when they removed measles, whooping cough and influenza. Okay, that was in the Commonwealth yearbook of Australia in 1953. And now, so what we’re saying here is that yes, there were still cases of measles, but they were non serious, so they can report on them. Because what’s the point of self limiting? It gives long term immunity in the individual, and it creates herd immunity. So that’s why they were removed from the National notifiable disease list. Now, compare that to 2016 to 2020. Every measles cases, is treated as a public health emergency. Yes, when the media reports on them, I don’t tell you if that was a serious case of disease or a non serious case of disease. They don’t tell you if it was a vaccinated case or an unvaccinated case you get no context.

Molly Knight 42:09
Or if there were co liabilities with that,

Dr Judy Wilyman 42:12
as well. And any case that wasn’t hospitalized certainly didn’t need to be reported because then person is better in a week or two, and then they’ve got long term immunity. So So this is all the history that a PhD that’s the history that I’ve studied, and and what they’re trying to do is rewrite history. And they’ve been quite successful because the school curriculums from 1990 onwards, changed, and they started to promote the fact that vaccines control based diseases, and that’s, you know, they create herd immunity, and the vaccines don’t cause autism. Now, all of that is indoctrination. And it’s been happening for three decades. My PhD wouldn’t exist if, you know, it wasn’t showing that those things are simply not true. And the medical industry did try to ensure that it was removed from the University website. They set up a petition when it was first put up. Oh, my goodness, yes. And they and they got to the medical industry with their lobby groups. They’re very powerful in Australia. Yes. And they got about 2000 signatures on it, but the Vice Chancellor of one gone University said, We are standing by that PhD, because he knew that it had gone through the very rigorous procedures that they have in place for a PhD. Yes. So then the lobby group said, Oh, but they didn’t check Judy, why elements PhD, but you see, they didn’t have to, because the air had gone through all the procedures, I had to do twice as much as anybody else to actually get it approved. And, you know, so all the way down the road they have attempted to suppress and remove the history of vaccines that is presented in my PhD.

Molly Knight 43:59
Well Because it’s a big business, I think the dollar always wins, doesn’t it? Yeah, it’s all about money always. Um, so where does that leave us with this COVID vaccine? Have you got a lot of info about what’s coming and in Nash and what it might how it might affect the human race to say,

Dr Judy Wilyman 44:24
Well, you know, you, it’s quite intriguing to me that, you know, the government can claim for decades and provide a standard response to everybody that asks about the safety of vaccines. We’ve always been taught for the last two or three decades. Vaccines are safe and effective, and they’ve been tested for 10 years minimum before they’ve been put on the market. And now you have a government saying that they’re going to bring in a genetically engineered vaccine with mRNA in it in space of next 18 months. Hmm. You know, and so, I mean, there’s the key for parents, you know, if so, so now, you know the, the why would we believe that any of the other vaccines have been tested for 10 years, which we know they weren’t. For example, the Gardasil vaccine was fast tracked in the same way and put on the market in 2006. Again, having used in adequate surrogate endpoints for advocacy, and no no in placebos in properly designed safety studies with significant power to prove anything. So again, a tragedy. Yes,

Molly Knight 45:42
yeah, absolutely. Quite.

Dr Judy Wilyman 45:45
It is an experiment on the population because it’s an end. It’s an unmonitored one. Because the government doesn’t use an active surveillance system once it’s in phase four trials, which simply means it’s in the population But they now are using it in the population. That’s your phase four trials, you’re the experiment. But the government does not actively follow up the health outcomes of every vaccinated person. And you would need to do that for at least five to 10 years to find the patterns and the frequency of chronic illness or deaths that have been caused by these vaccines. That’s fine that the government can’t provide those statistics. And they’ll simply say, you know, serious vaccine reactions are ran. Well, that’s not a quantity. And they shouldn’t be getting away with actually saying that when people’s health, the health of the population has declined significantly as we’ve increased the number of vaccines in the population.

Molly Knight 46:47
Oh, absolutely. I mean, excuse me. I’ve been in practice since 1983. And I have seen an absolute decline in children’s health. By that, I mean, I don’t Have stats but more each year more and more children I see as patients and their chronically ill, it’s not Oh yeah, I’ve got a really serious infection. No, it’s these chronic aches and pains. It’s my child keeps getting cold after cold, you’re cold and, and I’ve seen that grow over the years, to the point where now probably the last six to eight years seeing a lot of teenagers with all sorts of mental issues anxiety, panic attacks, depression, and I never saw before ever. No, no, my slide these vaccines as they get more and more of them and there’s dozens of things.

Dr Judy Wilyman 47:46
Those ones Yeah, Molly’s disgrace, similar experiences myself in the school system and you with the natural path. And we’ve watched this chronic illness skyrocket. And then what you call ecological evidence, when scientists and governments don’t do the right thing and investigate a direct dose response relationship showing a correlation, then the the best evidence you’ve got is the health of the population. And that’s called ecological evidence. And then why what drives me back to the university was I was seeing that ecological evidence of chronic illnesses, autoimmune diseases that are, you know, even the mechanism is known in dogs, they knew that the vaccines were causing auto antibodies, because of some of the proteins in the manufacturing process that was so similar to human proteins. So you know, when they manufacture a vaccine, it can be on calf tissue. It can be on chicken eggs, it can be on even human fetal cells it for the measles, the MMR vaccine, human fetal cells. Well, well, that’s that those Proteins foreign proteins are so similar to our own proteins that the body makes what are called auto antibodies. And that leads to autoimmune diseases and what what has skyrocketed in children? Yes, no immune disease lothbrok rheumatoid arthritis, chronic fatigue syndromes, multiple sclerosis, lupus, they’re all disease, you know, and that ecological evidence is very important. So, just recently with them, this coven endemic or planned me, I was introduced to Dr. Judy, Judy mikovits. His research and her experiences parallel mine in that she was actually exposing the mechanisms by which the vaccines cause that chronic illness. So whilst I was associating the chronic illness with the schedule, she actually identified the mechanisms by which the biological mechanisms by which the vaccines Cause, you know, the neurological damage and autoimmune diseases. Because, you know, again, her reputation was smeared just like mine was she even child, you know, tragically and that’s the lengths to which they went to try and cover up that research. In my case, allegations of academic misconduct were made by a leader of one of Australia’s biggest medical industry lobby group. You know, dr. john Cunningham was allowed to make allegations of academic misconduct, eight years after my master’s thesis actually watered and I was given a high distinction for it. And when they investigated it, there was complete fabrication. And I was given an apology and compensation, but the media would not do a press release and say that the allegations have been False and fabricated. And yes, my name had been smeared with these allegations when they had been made prior to the investigation going ahead, you know, so all of that humiliation, all of the damage to my reputation. Yes, the media did not take action in the public interest to let them know that not a single thing in that in my whooping cough research that had been smeared with that allegation was changed. It is still sitting unchanged on the website, because there was not Nope, no problems with that. And that’s in the public interest.

Molly Knight 51:38
It’s very hard to, for me to understand how the media can be so blatantly biased and I guess perhaps they bought and sold as well, I suppose.

Dr Judy Wilyman 51:55
You know, yeah, they’re using the argument of false balance and

Molly Knight 52:01
By that,

Dr Judy Wilyman 52:02
by false balance, you need to weigh up the weight of evidence for the risks and the benefits of a procedure. So, in fact, it is a real thing. But it’s been misused in this case, because I have now weighed up the risks and the benefits of vaccines from an independent study with all the available publicly available government evidence. And I have discovered that the risks of that program far outweigh any benefits that have been provided in the government documents. And hence, it would be false balance. And it’s actually the reverse of what the media is doing. The false balance is in this promotion of the benefits of vaccines, and just claiming that, that the risks are minimal, you know, in fact, it’s the other way round. You know, there’s a high risk from the ground By schedule of 12 to 16 vaccines, and it would be inappropriate to present a balanced picture of the benefits and risks when we know that the risks are really high for using 12 to 16 vaccines in a genetically diverse population, that’s what people need to keep in mind. You don’t medicate an entire population simply because everybody has individual genetics. Hmm. And so and so the false balance argument is being misused and it needs to be reversed. They using arguments that we should be using to say that, you know, the risks are overwhelmingly greater than the benefits of this combined program. And it needs to be properly assessed, and certainly parents need to have that autonomy, assigned to doctors, actually, their autonomy in promoting health has been removed as well because we need our autonomy back and parents have the right to do side which vaccines they should use in their own children because we are all genetically individual. And that is a crime against humanity.

Molly Knight 54:10
Yeah. And it’s a human right to make choices for your

Dr Judy Wilyman 54:13
privacy of their bodies, their autonomy and bodily integrity, and it’s protected in every international human rights covenant that Australia has ratified, not just signed up to we’ve ratified it, but the one step we didn’t take was to put it into domestic laws. And apparently that’s why that you know, the medical industry could lobby our governments and bringing mandatory backs using the Murdoch News Corp media, because men have now owns 80% of our media in Australia. There’s no diversity of opinion happening. And and by putting this by simply promoting it as no jab, no pay. Anybody that didn’t have children, so Oh, okay. In unvaccinated means you haven’t had one or two vaccines. What what was never presented in any media radical without pushing through that policy? Was that unvaccinated mean that you hadn’t had that the children hadn’t had a minimum of 12 vaccines in their first year of law. And that that meant 24 doses, by the way.

Molly Knight 55:17
That’s right. Yeah,

Dr Judy Wilyman 55:19
I took two months. I tested it for, you know, four months, six months. And so, by the age of one, no job, no pay and play actually meant an infant, you know, at a minimum of 12 vaccines. And the government was actually recommending six days and not making it clear to parents which were mandated and which words of course, most of them are getting 16 because they’re recommended, you know, and again, that’s misleading and false and misleading information and, and they’re causing serious ill health and chronic illness and deaths in the population. And again, that’s a problem. That’s a problem. journalists to be providing false and misleading information in the media, and

Molly Knight 56:05
that they should be held accountable.

Dr Judy Wilyman 56:08
That’s right, that they’ve reversed all of the arguments and suppressed and sense of the academic literature of myself and many others. And, you know, when that is when you debate on these forums, like the conversation website, we get ridiculed and abused as if it was Facebook. And even though they claim that it’s an academic forum where you can present your information and that they have strict rules of conduct, they with with with this topic, they allow the the abuse and ridicule and once your reputation smeared, many professionals won’t speak up because they see what’s happened to other people. Yes. And it’s a form of violence as well. You know, it’s very difficult to continue doing it. So of course, then you do silence the opposition. Then you can claim Oh, look, we’ve got a consensus on the science. And that’s all that the public sees, because we’ve been completely abused. And, you know, it’s it’s hard in relationships because parents that people are getting your friends are getting false and misleading information and we’re being stigmatized as anti vaxxers. You know, it’s really quite, quite violence, it is a violence and people need to wake up to what sort of, is this a civilized society? Have we gone back to the medieval days where, you know, are we happy to have this division and people, instead of being allowed to debate different opinions, we’ve got groupthink due to bullying, you know, coming through the media, the media is driving in the medical industry through political avenues as well. And, you know, the politicians wouldn’t even look at the evidence I was providing from the university because Cause, you know, the medical lobby groups are so successful in, you know, making allegations of misconduct and then presenting them to the politicians, whatever, but also using Wikipedia. Wikipedia actually locks out individuals on these topics and we can’t change the information that’s up there. And there’s a lot of lies and and false information. And then you know, you have to live with it, even though you know that you’ve acted with integrity. And your only concern is the health of children and the population. What what other motive would I have, there’s, there’s no money involved in this, you lose your reputation. You know, I just hope that people are waking up listening now to what is happening in this country. And thankfully, we have one or two lawyers with integrity that is brought up to support us. And you know, there’s so much money involved in this that it’s keeping other lawyers the government pays many law firms. And they will lose that funding if they jump on this this issue. And the same with doctors. But, you know, I’d like to appeal to all doctors, nurses, police, everybody, the integrity needs to come back into institutions. And there is no future for our children. If this doesn’t happen, and so now would be a good time for people to come together in those professions and stand up together with the public. Yes, because, you know, there’s no science in locking up healthy people in quarantining people in hotels, you know, medically testing healthy people. Is that is that the country we want to live in? Because that will be the new norm. If professionals don’t come together now and challenge the government with this lack of science?

Molly Knight 59:51
Yes, actually, a friend from America was telling me that they’ve had over 300,000 cases of carbon dioxide poisoning from people wearing these masks for long periods of time, that it’s making them sick.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:00:08
It absolutely is making them sick. And it’s very clear from the scientific studies that have been done, how and why that happens. But the other thing too is when the media doesn’t report on these things, that it matters will not happen. You know, that’s the reality that media creates. And, you know, that’s what we’re getting here in Australia, and media that is hiding the suicide rates, the anxiety and depression about elderly people that are dying alone in, you know, aged care facilities because of this stupid rule. That disgraceful. They need to be segregated from the public, and that we have to have a vaccine to actually go and visit them and there’s no evidence to support that policy whatsoever. The scientific evidence doesn’t exist. We’ve asked for it. You know, if it existed, you know, we would debated, but and but there’s no evidence to say that using a flu vaccine prevents people from getting the flu or in fact, is related to, in fact, the science there’s many articles suggesting that if you have the flu vaccine, it makes you more susceptible to Coronavirus is when you’re in if you get infected, huh, yes. Serious? Yes. And the a lot of evidence like that. And so, you know, the government has just been doing what it’s like with without any accountability, because the media keeps keeps quiet on all of these issues. Yes,

Molly Knight 1:01:38
yes, we were in a terrible situation, really. And we’ve got to wake up and stand up and stand together to make change because we need change.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:01:49
We do and proof of causality is the key. Now I will point out that with COVID, the first cases that weren’t observed in China started around late December. And China mandated the flu vaccine for the first time in December 2019, as did Italy, and many European countries, Canada and Australia without aged care facilities. So for the first time ever, countries have mandated the flu vaccine. And lo and behold, the first and second waves of COVID occurred two or three weeks after the vaccine campaigns occurred in the aged care facilities. Now we want evidence based medicine and the PCR tests the antibody tests and not identifying that particular size Cove to virus they do not have high specificity for that virus, and they’re not licensed diagnostic tools. So we also want that correlation It is quite possible that the neurological damage that is being caused is caused by the vaccines. There’s strong evidence because flu vaccines in aged care facilities in past years have caused a cluster of deaths and illnesses after the campaigns. And the current report on it doesn’t happen. And so we need that correlation investigated as well to prove or disprove whether the flu vaccine has caused most of these Koba deaths because the fact is that the majority have occurred in elderly people over the age of 80. And they all have had co-morbidities, they’re not dying, just from a virus. They’ve all had comorbidities that in previous years would have been listed as the cause of death, you know, cancer, or lung disease or pneumonia, you know, strokes. All of those things are being pushed aside to label at COVID just on a suspected diet. nosis and no proof from any licensed diagnostic test. And so we mustn’t let the government get away with this.

Molly Knight 1:04:08
Yes, agree. quite agree.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:04:10
Yeah. And because our media won’t publicize it and assistant See, normally you have a media to make the government accountable for these policies. But we haven’t had that for over a decade. And I’ve experienced the strategies that have been used to prevent us having that voice and making our government accountable. And that goes for the family court system as well. The bias and corruption in the family court system I have experienced in attempting to because now we have so many parents who are fighting each other over the vaccination issue. Yes, yes, sir. Then they don’t want to vaccinate and the other one won’t look at anything. If it hasn’t come from the government or the you know, the doctor. And so therefore, we have a lot of anxiety depression in parents now having children and they’re ending up in the court. This is very divisive. Australia is not a pleasant place to be having children at this point in time. And you know, this issue, this was never an issue pre, you know, the 19th?

Molly Knight 1:05:11
Yes, it’s a very sad state, isn’t it?

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:05:14
That’s right. And we were never at risk from these diseases after 1950 no serious risk to the majority of people, the asymptomatic cases, in the majority of cases, you know, in a developed country, 99% of these cases will be asymptomatic or mild, and that goes for the COVID virus as well.

Molly Knight 1:05:36
And in fact, you would, I would have thought the government would want herd immunity to an unknown virus. So isolating people and wearing masks is exactly the opposite. To get some herd immunity. That’s very

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:05:54
strange decisions, no goes right. You know, and that’s where we need to ask why In the first place right at the very, very beginning, why was the government thinking simply out of after one month of cases of this new coronavirus being observed? Why was it thinking global pandemic? And let’s let’s look at how they call the global pandemic one we have talked about the change in definition, yes to, they then needed large numbers of deaths and illnesses. So a mathematical formula was used, and it had false assumptions in that formula. And that was after a few of us pointed that out because you seem he can’t use generic assumptions for every country in the world to to decide how a virus will behave in each country. He says I mentioned the different environmental conditions host characteristics, genes, constitution and quality of health care system. But so that’s how they produce this enormous exaggerated numbers of deaths that would happen if this virus entered the country. Hence, they use that to lock down healthy populations now. It’s again, flawed of all flawed, and you don’t locked down half population, the first thing you need to do is experience that virus in the country to see if it’s going to be a problem, in our circumstances, our specific environmental and hosted consensus, and we have a wonderful health care system, you know, so none of that happened. And as you said, the directives that were brought in are all the opposite to how you would promote health anyway, everything will make us more unhealthy. Exactly, you know, and you can’t say that’s an unintended consequence. You know, the medical health literature has been promoting ways of health promotion for decades. You know, in the medical literature, that’s what we’ve been using for decades. So it wasn’t done intended to help consequences. We know that you isolate the sick people. We know you don’t lock up healthy people in stuffy rooms and give them poor nutrition and not let them go out for exercise for two weeks. You know that is criminal intent using fraudulent tests and unlicensed diagnostic tests and that needs to be made accountable.

Molly Knight 1:08:21
Yes, absolutely. The government’s have got a lot to answer for. And individually, they need to be held accountable.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:08:30
Absolutely. And when anyone’s not aware, I mean serene for her. And she sent out the class action to end the legal action that she was taking against all the state premiers if they didn’t remove directives, such as the mandatory flu vaccine, and many other directives that have removed freedom of rights without scientific evidence, and the borders as well as the borders need to be opened. There’s no reason to have those borders closed and You sent that letter out on the 20th of August. And the premiers were required to take action by the 27th of August. And if they didn’t, then legal action was starting. So I don’t think the media has publicized that fact. And I think it’s important that the public knows that lawyers are picking this up, and that the fraudulent reporting on cases and deaths of this disease is a critical point. And premiers can be made liable under civil rights and in the courts for personally liable for the fact that the figures and statistics have not been properly reported. Yeah.

Molly Knight 1:09:43
So I would just make a suggestion that as many people as possible go to serines pay page webpage advocate. advocate me it, isn’t it? Yeah. And join her soon join her in her civil action needs to support Let’s jump on board everyone go to her page. Yes.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:10:05
And people need to know that closing a border and putting the military on it is not keeping out of ours. And certainly there is no need for the military to be there now the borders need to be opened and business as normal, and the herd immunity in the population builds naturally to any new mutated coronavirus. This virus has been downgraded. It is not transmitting any more quickly than other influenza viruses. And the overall mortality rate is no different to other flu years. We know in some countries, it’s been a strong flu season in other countries a mild flu season but we are not experienced any greater number of deaths this year to other previous years.

Molly Knight 1:10:48
Yeah, exactly. It’s pretty well standard how it is every year, isn’t it? We have some countries worse and others. Yeah,

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:10:54
that’s right.

Molly Knight 1:10:55
And if you look at some of the stats you notice that have diseases

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:11:01
That’s it. That’s

mine. Yeah. Yeah,

Molly Knight 1:11:06
influence data.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:11:08
So So what’s happened is, you know that, you know, they’ve reported on deaths that happen every year. Normally they’re all these deaths they’ve reported on them. And even on suspected cases, they’ve labeled at COVID as a, as opposed to the comorbidity that was that they were living with prior to the death. And they haven’t reported on whether those deaths were vaccinated cases or unvaccinated. So that’s information that we should know about how many of these have the flu vaccine, and you know, exactly a range of things.

Molly Knight 1:11:38
Yes. An interesting fact that I’ve often thought about is I think it was last year was the first year here in Australia that they had a special vaccine. I flew back for the elderly, so anyone over 65 had an extra strain, very special. And it’s interesting that there are so many elderly deaths with He’s cozy, right? Yeah,

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:12:02
yeah. Is there a correlation? well understand the second wave happened, you know, two or three weeks after we mandated that vaccine for all visitors. And, of course, the Aged Care residents, they most of them accepted anyway, because they’ve been indoctrinated to say that it’s beneficial. And so it was only the health care workers and the visitors that they needed to mandate it for. But you know, that correlation is significant. And proof of causality is the key to this entire health situation. And if they want to claim they’re using medical, sorry, evidence based medicine again, they need to look at all correlations and possible causes of the deaths.

Molly Knight 1:12:49
Yes, exactly. Yeah, exactly. Wow. Okay. Let’s have a couple of questions, Judy. Just let me read these. Okay, there’s a few Do you think they can make it mandatory? So, this is obviously the COVID vaccine. Amy is asking do you think they can actually make it mandatory,

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:13:11
not have the people object and rise up and resist, you know, this, you know, this is our bodies, it saves our children’s future and freedom, we need to stand up and and not allow them to do this. So if we stand up a mess, people power can change that situation. And, you know, I think a lot more people are waking up to the fact that vaccines have not been proven to be safe and effective. And the very fact that they rolling this out in you know, nine months, you know, nine months and they started manufacturing and only a month after then the novel coronavirus was discovered, you know, the plan damage is clearly a pandemic Many people are now aware that population control is part of the agenda. And, you know, there’s all sorts of talk of nanoparticles being present in a possible vaccine, which will enable people to be scanned and, you know, to determine if they’re vaccinated or unvaccinated and of course, the immunity passes have been talking about so that we won’t so coercive vaccination. And, you know, I think many, many more people now are aware that mandatory vaccine is a crime against humanity. Absolutely, yes. Because it means our individual James, you know, it should never have passed in the no job, no pay or play and we want that repealed. And we will fight to ensure that this is repealed for our children’s health, the sake of our children, and a free future for all of us. So, no, it can’t happen if we keep talking and waking up the population and showing that the evidence does doesn’t exist for any mandatory vaccination. You’re quite different to choosing whether you want to use a vaccine. We’re talking mandatory vaccine and corrosive vaccination. There’s no justification for that whatsoever.

Molly Knight 1:15:12
Yes, great. And if people want to take the vaccine if they that brave, then go for it.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:15:18
Yeah, exactly. nobody’s taking away anyone’s right to use the vaccine. But the key here is that it’s a different argument to talk about mandatory and coercive vaccination. And it is an experiment on the population when you’re bringing something in, you know, fast tracking a medical intervention without the long term health safety effects of that vaccine, and all vaccines do cause neurological damage. Let me just point out that the swine flu vaccine used in 1976 and in 2009, caused narcolepsy and other neurological damage That was proven and compensation cases were put through in Sweden. In the US in the 1976, swine flu. Suppose that pandemic, they vaccinated, you know, 10s of thousands of people and many of them got Guillain Barre syndrome, cerebral palsy, these seizures, convulsions, that’s all documented, yet we’re repeating history. And it is now time for the public to start talking about this issue and making sure we’ve got a media that will actually represent the public’s voice. This has to be changed.

Molly Knight 1:16:38
Yes, absolutely. And I think there’s quite a few cases around the world is Italy, India, the Philippines and South Africa. I think that assuming you’re GAVI, I guess, and Bill Gates and his polio vaccine for all the damage and deaths.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:16:59
That’s Right, I heard I heard a German lawyer speaking today. And he actually gave a speech on the 29th of August with Robert Kennedy at the the Berlin, huge protests and marches that they had there. And yes, he said that they’re starting litigation in the Civil Rights courts. They will be a personal liability for governors in the US and of course, premiers here in Australia, and other public politicians figures who have, you know, used the fraudulent PCR tests and antibody tests to repeat port cases of COVID when in fact they’re not allies license diagnostic tool. So yes, litigation in Germany, California, and other areas of the US has already started on that the fraudulent reporting of cases.

Molly Knight 1:17:55
Yeah. Which is so true. So it’s your

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:17:58
that’s driving your car. It has actually come out and admitted that they had over. They had labeled many thousands of cases as COVID that weren’t close cases. So they’ve actually admitted that they their statistics were inflated, wrongly, and on top of the fact that the PCR test is not a licensed diagnostic tool.

Molly Knight 1:18:21
Yes, exactly. What um, hang on. Sorry. I’m just looking at a message here. It’s about the PCR test. What are the specifics associated with it? What, what makes it some not a valid test?

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:18:40
Okay, so the PCR test is a test that normally identifies DNA sequences of DNA in the genomes of viruses. In this case, it’s a bit we’re looking at RNA, the corona viruses and RNA virus. And for this for the PCR test to even identify the segments, it’s got to magnify it thousands of times. And then it’s only identifying segments of the virus. So unless you have a whole it unless you’ve got a test that can isolate the whole virus to prove that that particular virus was present causing that disease, then you haven’t proved causality. And all they’ve done there is just identify segments of RNA that are similar to, you know, the source code to RNA, but it’s not the whole virus. And so that doesn’t prove causality. And also, the test isn’t standardized across states, countries, whatever. So the number of times you magnify it determines, you know, whether you’ll get a positive or a negative result. If you don’t, if you’re not using a standard number of magnifications. Then you know, the finger in you know, maybe on the east is Different to a positive result on the east might have been a negative result over here, you know, so they’re not standardizing the test either. And different crazy good or positive results if they magnify and, you know, do a greater magnification. Mm hmm.

Molly Knight 1:20:16
Well, you know, for me, I think if there’s lots of positive cases, and they’re not seek, that’s a great thing, because you can say, well, there’s some herd immunity beginning but they never mentioned any of that do that.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:20:28
No, no, and it’s best that Healthy People do not get medically tested that is not something we want to live with it it’s an infringement of our right to live naturally in society. That’s our bodies. There should be no medically testing of healthy people. Yeah. You only get tested if you’ve got symptoms of a disease that you believe could be serious that’s that’s quite different. And you know the the effect of this you know, taking temperature by shooting a gun at the A laser beam that can go to near the pineal gland. And, you know, do we want that as the new norm when it’s unnecessary and unscientific and possibly a risk to the hormonal balance of the body? You know, who’s who’s investigated that, you know, they brought this in without any sort of assessment of what damage they’re actually causing by doing and, you know, on top of the fact that it’s a removal of our human right, you know, to participate in society without being tested. You know, and I feel for the children in schools actually, at the moment as well.

Molly Knight 1:21:37
Then what’s happening in wi Judy? That’s, yes, very scary. I think

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:21:42
it’s very scary because a school should not be a place for medical testing, or for any experiments to be going on with children, you know, but apparently they’re doing a clinical trial here in Wi Fi, ran by the telethon Institute for children’s health and Nurses are going into the schools and taking cheek swabs from the children. You know, so they come in masks, you know, with their masks on and gloves and take a cheek swab, but I’m not sure the purpose of a cheek swab because that’s not a PCR test. So it’s not related to COVID. I have heard that there’s a clause in the contract that the government has with the Chinese company that they bought the PCR tests from. And there’s a clause that says that the DNA genome can be retained by both the Australian Government and the Chinese government. So that clause apparently exists in our contract. So is this a case of collecting DNA? What is it the sounds like it of nurses going into the schools and collecting cheek swabs from children and why are schools being used Just medical testing grounds in the first place. And vaccines in schools is a step too far. You know, individuals need individual advice as to whether they should get a vaccine or not. But all of that went out the door. And without discussion and debate, the pharmaceutical companies have literally made these policies throughout governments and they’ve reduced the age of children to 14 so that now a 14 year olds can get a vaccine without telling their parents they can get other medical treatments without telling their parents because that I it was reduced to 14 but a child 14 cannot assess the literature. And parents are their legal guardian. We have a duty to look after the health of our children but who consulted us on reducing the age of children to 14

Molly Knight 1:23:53
Yes, absolutely. That’s

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:23:55
areas 18 a child is under 18. You know, and he 16 might have been more sensible, but, you know, 14? No, no, it’s been removed as a democracy in Australia and it hasn’t been 14 years.

Molly Knight 1:24:14
Yeah, we definitely have to make some changes and

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:24:16
now that’s it.

Molly Knight 1:24:18
Okay, another question. Someone Masha has said, Have you forwarded your thesis to ministers around Australia to read? They probably won’t read it.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:24:33
I spent many years I spent a decade writing to politicians writing to the Human Rights Commission, writing to the health department and the chief medical officers. I put in submissions for the no job no pay inquiry, Senate inquiry. I put in submissions to the Human Rights Commission emit Amendment Bill for discrimination In policy, and all of my submissions were ignored. And, in fact, for the Senate inquiry for the no job, no pay, thousands of people put in submissions, and the majority of them were against the no job, no pay, but they were all ignored. So it’s not just the academic information that I have been providing and all the letters I’ve had so many standard letters have replied, vaccines are safe and effective. And, you know, and and they’ve been tested for 10 years. We, we strongly support the government vaccination program, because it’s for community health, you know, and everybody’s getting them but they never answer the questions, the specific questions we ask. And when I sent letters to the Human Rights Commission, they would pass it on to the health department, you know, so nobody is answering the questions. Our Human Rights Commission is actually toothless with respect to him. Human Rights and particularly medical freedom. That wasn’t even on the agenda for the conversation last year. She

Molly Knight 1:26:08
Okay, we need change your lanta has asked Would you please comment on the use of ventilators as compared with respirators with the COVID patients?

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:26:20
were like, I can’t really do that because I’m not a medical doctor. And what I know was with COVID, and just through listening to nurses and doctors speak, is that the ventilators were being misused, that they that a ventilator is something that an elderly patient is put on to prolong their life when they know there’s no other options. And it’s just to prolong life for a little bit longer. Most people die once they’ve been put on a ventilator. So now being misused for the COVID outbreak. I also know that there was incentives Doctors to use the ventilators.

Molly Knight 1:27:04
And installous wasn’t the right

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:27:06
and incentives also to label a patient as covid, even without any clinical or laboratory evidence, all of that was incentivized, as has been the doctors with regard to vaccination that they were getting paid per person that they vaccinated or Yeah, and medical centers get paid to raise the immunization rates of under four year olds, they get a lump sum from pharmaceutical companies. So there’s your financial rewards are being used to misuse a lot of the the ventilators and, and other protocols in the hospitals. That was another way in which deaths happened prematurely. They reversed a lot of the protocols that normally happen, and, you know, it caused more harm than than benefit and

yeah, that’s where a lot of illness and deaths came from as well.

Molly Knight 1:28:01
What can you say? What can you say? Yeah, it is. It’s unbelievable. And you know that these people who accept all the bribes, the money, these are human beings, you know, where is their integrity?

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:28:17
Well, that’s where I’m appealing to them now because, you know, I did understand, you know, previously they’re in a rough between a rock and a hard place. Until enough people stand up together, then they the doctors certainly weren’t gagged in being able to present you know, their knowledge of the academic literature and the risks of vaccines. However, you know, we’ve got serene doing a class action against the Australian health practitioners regulatory authority to ensure that doctors are able to speak openly about their own assessment of the medical literature. And, you know, it’s very clear in health promotion in order to promote Health. People need autonomy over their own bodies. Yes, autonomy is removed, health declines, it is a health promotion and needs autonomy over our bodies. And it certainly needs a medical profession that has autonomy to assist the medical interpreter for themselves. Yeah, they’re the doctors, not the regulatory authority. Exactly, yes. And then the medical industry or pharmaceutical companies that are influencing their education. You see, we want the doctors there the either, you know, and people with the knowledge to be able to assist medical literature and they need to be able to speak openly. And that’s how we’ve arrived at this medical tyranny. Yes, regulation of doctors and their gagging of or removal of their autonomy

Molly Knight 1:29:52
to Yeah, it is and also just slightly different topic, but the hydroxychloroquine If the GP now prescribes it, the pharmacy, the pharmacy, pharmacists can override the doctor’s prescription and the pharmacist can say no.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:30:12
Well, how can that?

Yep. And again, if they did that, you know, that would be a crime, because they’re 70 years of evidence saying that the hydroxychloroquine is a good for COVID and flu like illness such as COVID. And so clearly, they need to be careful about overriding that because that could be considered a criminal offence and they could be held liable for withholding and known cure for a disease. And they know we’re getting into pretty interesting territory when they spin this, you know, the TGA perhaps could be, you know, held responsible or made accountable to for putting in that directory. Yes, exactly. withholding treatments.

Molly Knight 1:31:03
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It’s insane. It’s insane. Yeah, it is. It is. Now another one. Virginia has asked, Is there a way we can get the stuff out from the child system? Now? I’m assuming she’s maintaining the chemicals or the additives in vaccines?

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:31:24
Yes. Right. Well, I know that a lot. A lot of holistic doctors use chelation and other methods to try and detoxify the body. So definitely, yes. You know, go to your holistic doctors and try and do that. But remember, if you choose to use a vaccine, you know, it does contain chemicals and foreign DNA, and that can affect your quality of life. Once your quality of life is gone, it is much harder to get it back so it doesn’t require you know, a proper investigation. of what you’re going to do with your child’s body and your own body. And, you know, I think too many people are just blindly following what the government is saying, and not making an effort to investigate for themselves and decide the risks and benefit of so many vaccines. Well, they’re not

Molly Knight 1:32:19
educated to do that there. It’s the opposite, you know, is

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:32:23
the indoctrination through the school system. And I mean, even celebrities and comedians, they’ve been incentivized to actually promote vaccines, when you must have noticed how all the comedians in Australia have taught at some point how to guard anti vaxxers Yes, comedian knows anything about science and, you know, the benefits or risks of a vaccine. And yet, they’re happy to make anti vaxxers the butt of their jokes and I’ve seen every one of them do it, you know, of course, because I turned to comedy to try and, you know, keep my sanity. And of course,

Unknown Speaker 1:33:01
not healthy. It was,

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:33:03
you know, I find it very interesting that, that they’ve got children as well. And it’s the one political issue where, you know, you’re allowed to abuse and ridicule people, even academics and professionals that speak up, you know, you’re actually encouraged to do it and probably incentivized, obviously, yes. But can we just get people to start thinking about this? You know, why is it a political issue that you can bully people into believing? And until we get people to start thinking for themselves? And this means that celebrities and comedians now have to act with integrity as well. Because they need to start thinking about their own kids future and what what they want for them and you know, we all live in this world together and do they like bullying and ridiculing and is that how they want their children to be treated in the playground? I know many Parents who have educated their children on vaccines, and these children are getting bullied in the playground, and they’re getting bullied by teachers in the classroom. Teachers are actually singling them out and saying, oh, you’re an unvaccinated child and making them feel bad. And and, you know, that is very, very damaging. And, and it’s a very divisive society that, you know, I it’s interesting that people are so happy to accept that. Um, yeah,

Molly Knight 1:34:28
yeah, you’re right. It’s, it’s quite tragic,

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:34:32
actually, that we’ve got this far down the road. So, you know, we really do have to, to wake people up quickly. And everybody needs to keep talking about this, you know, to their friends and trying to introduce it in a way that will open their minds because I know the government’s used psychological strategies to close people’s minds, the cognitive dissonance, is that a Paik? Absolutely, yeah, with the media control that we have It has been very difficult to talk to anyone on this issue.

Molly Knight 1:35:05
Yeah, I agree. But I think I have faith because if you look at the people are definitely waking up and questioning things. And you think about all these people speaking out about the the dangers or the dis the non disclosure of truth around vaccines, it’s all medical professionals. It’s not Joe Blow, who you know, just does the garden twice a week. These are medical professionals, you are questioning the the efficacy and the safety of this instrument that we are, well, I think being forced onto us through coercion,

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:35:53
or dishonesty. That is it is and you know, I think it was always going to take an event like COVID To help us expose the lies that the government has been selling this program on for decades, and yeah, school curriculums, and, you know, even the University of Wollongong and they used a strategy once my PhD was approved, and as soon as it was published on the University website, they ensured that 60 academics from the faculty of science, medicine and health, were required to sign their names to a statement on the university’s website, saying that they support the government’s vaccination program. Now, not a single one of those academics had even read my thesis or investigated vaccines for themselves. So they’ve never investigated the government’s claims of safety and efficacy, yet they signed their name to that statement. And that in itself, you know, was difficult for me, but that shows up breach of academic integrity by the university. Yes. And so what was the point of doing a PhD investigating the schedule when none of them debated or read my thesis and all of them blindly signed their names to that, that support for government vaccination policy. And, and that is deceptive to the public. So deceptive.

Molly Knight 1:37:25
Yeah, very deceptive. We have been deceived in many, many things over the last 20 or 30. What 3040 years really is. I think it’s been a very clever plan to get us to a position where we have little freedom. Well, no freedoms, almost little choice and we just have to bow down

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:37:48
and I won’t know what this is.

You know, we’ve lost many pips. So many people now have lost so much. We’ve lost our sense of community We have nothing left to lose. And that’s why I say to everybody to start thinking about in their profession, are they acting with integrity? And yeah, is this the Australia you want to live with? Are these the new norms that you think are acceptable for your children? We’ve had freedom and there’s no reason to remove our personal autonomy over our own bodies. And, you know, all these facial recognition cameras that are coming in with the five G. You know, there’s an agenda of population control that I think, you know, people like to present it perhaps as a conspiracy theory, but you’ve got to look at the evidence. The evidence is there. The 5g is going up, the facial recognition cameras are going in. The politicians are talking about community. immunity passes cozy passes in a vaccination certificate so you can participate in society. They’ve got the military on the borders, look at the evidence, we have got nothing left to lose. And so don’t be fearful to stand up. Just, you know, what sort of future Do you want for your children? And what do you want integrity in the institutions because we need to bring back integrity in many of these institutions. So now is the time to stand together to do this. Hmm, we cannot be fearful. Absolutely. I think as soon as you allow that temperature check or medical test of a healthy person, then you have complied. And they will continue doing this until we resist.

Molly Knight 1:39:43
Yes, yes. Time to say no.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:39:46
Absolutely. And all borders need to be open. There is no reason to have those borders closed. Now.

Molly Knight 1:39:52
It’s quite ridiculous when you think about it. Um, you know, viruses float in the air for goodness sakes. They don’t This is the border. Thank you.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:40:02
Well, this is it.

They did. Viruses are not living things. And the other thing people need to remember is that just because you’re exposed to a virus, doesn’t mean you’re going to get sick or disease. The virus can only cause disease if certain environmental factors, as I’ve said, are present or certain host characteristics are present. And the virus will cause maybe asymptomatic infection in many people, pseudo and mild infection in some people, and very rarely in a developed country, would you get serious illness from one of these from the virus? You know, this virus is not any more serious than a normal influenza virus. So this is why the borders need to be opened. The reporting has been fraudulent, and people have been misinformed as to how viruses cause disease. I’d like to just If I could raid one of the things that I came across in my research, which really should help emphasize the fact that a virus on its own does not cause disease, at least 99% of people will get an asymptomatic or mild infection from that virus. And in 1960 Frank but Frank MacFarlane, Burnett received the Nobel Prize for immunology in Australia. He stated that genetics, nutrition, psychological and environmental factors may play a more important role in resistance to disease than the assumed benefits of artificial immunity induced by vaccination. He considered the genetic deterioration of the population may be a consequence of universal mass vaccination. And in 1960s are only using two vaccines, three vaccines at that point? Yes, we postulate Did that in the long term vaccination may be against the best interests of the state? Well, that’s what we’ve observed, the genetic fabric of the population is deteriorating, we have seen chronic illness skyrocket in children tenfold in direct dose response relationship to the vaccination program. So here is a Nobel Prize Laureate from 1960 predicting this situation. And we have a government that has refused to investigate this direct correlation between the expansion of the schedule and all the illness that we’re seeing in the population. You know, this illness is a serious long term chronic illness that many people will not live the potential that they were born with. And apparently the long term cares and I’ll say their children died before them. It is time to have this debate, and millions of people have autistic children and that evidence has not been investigated.

Molly Knight 1:43:02
Yes, yes, it’s time that we make some change make it happen, because the government’s the current governments aren’t going to look at any of this. They too. They’re corrupt. Sorry, but they just corrupt

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:43:14
What? I have experienced some of that corruption. It’s very sad. And now we are at a point where we’re losing our freedoms over this. And I think, yeah, the lawyers do need to pick this up, and we need to support them and make sure that there’s accountability for these decisions that are so blatantly against health promotion of the community.

Molly Knight 1:43:40
Yeah, yeah, quite agree. So, certainly, let me encourage everyone again, go to serines web page advocate me and join her her suits join her class actions. Let’s support the work that is being done so that we can step by step Go in the right direction and get our freedoms back. Get our lives back.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:44:05
That’s wrong. Yeah, absolutely.

Molly Knight 1:44:09
Okay, on that note to the mob was talk, thank you so much I value your knowledge and your courage because it does take courage to step up and step out of the the norm and you do get attacked. I know.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:44:26
Yes, yeah, I won’t deny that. But you do have to have courage and just know that, you know, you’ve acted with integrity, and that, you know, if a medical procedure works, then educated people will be using it without being coerced or forced into that medication. Point. You do not need coercive medical practices. If the procedure works, it will speak for itself. Yes. And so this is where we really critically need investigation of the chronic illness in the population and whether you know, whether it is linked to this expanded vaccination program, which is the most likely cause because of the chemicals that we know are in it, and the foreign DNA that is in those vaccines. Yeah,

Molly Knight 1:45:16
quite scary what they put into some of these vaccinations as it is, yeah,

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:45:21
that’s what polysorbate 80 causes infertility and sodium borides. And you know, they’re in the Gardasil vaccine. That was one of the first things that I questioned, you know, and the TGA. And the understanding didn’t provide an answer. Just the standard vaccines are safe and effective and have been tested for 10 years. Well, at least the public can see now that they’re not tested for 10 years.

Molly Knight 1:45:44
Exactly. Yeah.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:45:45
And we have not been identified.

Molly Knight 1:45:48
Yeah, yeah. There’s a lot to be thankful for with this. cosy. Absolutely, because it’s opened a lot of eyes. Definitely. Yeah, hopefully

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:45:56
a lot more very rapidly.

Molly Knight 1:45:59
Yes, exactly. Exactly, yeah. All right. Well, I think that’s it, Julia. Unless you’ve got anything else. Well, I know you’ve got a lot more that you could add. But maybe another another night, we could talk a little deeper about vaccines and what’s actually in them, and the likely effects that it is having.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:46:20
Thank you. Thanks, Molly. That’s it.

Molly Knight 1:46:23
Yeah, very much. Appreciate you.

Dr Judy Wilyman 1:46:26
Thanks. Thank you. Yeah. Good night. Great. Thanks.

Molly Knight 1:46:29
Good night, everyone. Thanks for joining us. Thanks for staying with us tonight. It’s been a long talk. But it’s been an enormously valuable talk and Judy is very courageous because anyone who talks about the vaccine debate or the vaccine, yay or nay always gets a little bit of tact and I’ve had a few scathing moments in my lifetime in practice, but I always believe that what is there is You want to do it, you should have the freedom to actually do it, whether it’s something into your body or onto your body, whether you go to a movie or out for dinner, if you want to do it, we have freedom, or we did. We did, but they’ve been slowly eroded. So we need to all stand up together, to fight back and take back our human rights. So please join serene advocate me, jump on board with her litigation that she’s doing and become part of a group that makes really good change for the benefit of humanity. Because that’s what’s being threatened at the moment. Make no mistake, that’s what’s being threatened here. Okay, so good night, everybody. God bless. Thank you for staying with us. And I hope that you have gained as much from this talk as I have good night.


Jenny Johnston interview
Have these unprecedented times taken a toll on your mental health? Jenny Johnston, hypnotherapist and EFT practitioner joined us Thursday September 10th to discuss how EFT can support you in managing anxiety, pain, depression and fear.
In her live discussion with Molly Knight, Jenny discussed and demonstrated:
  • The beginnings of EFT Emotional Freedom Technique
  • How EFT can help anxiety, panic, depression, fear, anger



Jenny completed her Bachelor of Applied Science in Occupational Therapy in 1980. While working with outpatients suffering from severe anxiety disorders, she became aware of the amazing healing powers of relaxation therapy. She went on to gain qualifications in hypnotherapy, counselling, conflict resolution, Emotional Freedom Techniques (EFT) and Intuitive Energy Psychology (IEP). Melbourne based, Jenny endeavours to inspire, touch and move people so they can become whatever they desire and see the possibilities that are available to them when they remove what holds them back. She is a keynote speaker and author and enjoys Certifying Practitioners from around the world in both EFT and Quantum EFT. Read more about Jenny here:

Click on the image below to view the complete interview:



The complete transcript is presented below (E&OE) :

Molly Knight 0:00
Hello, everyone, welcome to Health Australia Party Thursday night talks. I’m Molly. Tonight we have a great talk. It’s about a topic that I’m incredibly passionate about. And it’s something that is a topic that is for every single person from children to adults to elderly adults. And tonight, if you want, you can join in and participate. It’s a bit of a hands on night. Now, this is definitely one of my favorite modalities doesn’t matter whether you’ve got a physical ailment or an emotional element. I know that this modality can help you. We’re talking about EFT Emotional Freedom Technique. And it’s a technique that I would love to see taught in schools. I think from Little kids, they’re very responsive to it and they love it. And it makes a real difference. It certainly can change lives and I’ve seen that happen. It’s very quick. It’s technique that you can learn, and you can use it really on on any issues as our guest tonight who will discuss with us now. Tonight we’ve got Jenny Johnston with us. Jenny first trained as an occupational therapist back in, I think it was 1980 and then she saw what relaxation could do for her patients. And she went and learned clinical hypnotherapy. Correct me if I’m wrong, Jen. And through the hypnotherapy, she was introduced to EFT she became a practitioner, and she went on to do further training and Jen studied to become a trainer herself. She’s taught hundreds of people probably thousands by now I reckon, on how to do EFT and how to use it for different issues. And Jenny over the years, she studied many different techniques. And with all her knowledge, she’s further developed the basically if t modality into a really powerful technique called quantum me of tea. She’s the author of two books. And we’ll talk a little bit more about this quantum EFT at the end of our session. Now, if you’ve got any questions at all tonight about anything, please, you know, type your little bit in I don’t see it, but we’ll get your questions. And at the end of our talk, Jenny will answer them for you. Welcome, Jenny, thank you so much for joining us tonight.

Jenny Johnston 2:26
It’s my pleasure, Molly. And we were just discussing before we went live, how, how we found each other and it was about eight years ago, we worked out because you were interested in EFT and you found me through EFT universe as a trainer. And at the time you had a radio show and you interviewed me on your radio show about eight years ago. So that’s how long we’ve known each other. Yeah, I knew I went back a while and I was trying to see how did we made sure it was for the radio. Yes, and you’ve trained with me since two as well.

Molly Knight 3:00
Yeah, yeah, yep, indeed. I love EFT I think of all the, you know, I’m passionate about my Herbes and homeopathics and vitamin therapies. But I think EFT just sits right on the top because it’s like the icing on the cake. And it works with everything. I haven’t seen any condition, physical or emotional that it can’t help. Hmm. It’s very powerful.

Jenny Johnston 3:25
Yeah, I agree. And when I was doing my hypnotherapy degree, it was then that somebody showed me EFT, and I was I was sold by it straight away just like you were. And I started using it with my clients who would come to me for hypnotherapy, often with stress and trauma. And when I looked at EFT sometimes what I call it is like waking hypnosis because the research shows us that when when Tapping on meridian points. So, and I’ll go through those meridian points when we tapping on them, we’re sending a pulse through our meridian system. And when that occurs, our brainwaves go into the subconscious range. So what I love about e of t is that we’re, we’re not consciously out of the picture. We’re still here consciously, but we’re working with the subconscious at the same time. And for those who have ever had kinesiology, where, you know, the kinesiology person can physiologist will talk to the body and then muscle test and the body answers so the body has a consciousness as well. So that’s what I love about EFT we’re working with consciousness, sub consciousness and body consciousness. And we’re able to get to really deep rooted belief systems that have been created, especially between zero and six when were in that heat. No godzik state and downloading everything is the truth. We’re able to get through core core belief systems and counter condition, a reaction or an automatic reaction, a stress reaction, a fight or flight reaction, or, or a conditioned belief system. You know, when people say, I, I always self sabotage, I get to a certain place and then I sabotage myself with relationships or with money or with something. And that’s because of a subconscious belief that’s running the show. And 95% of our behavior comes from subconscious, it’s automatic. So when people are doing conscious therapies like counseling and perhaps some psychology, etc, cognitive behavioral therapy, there, they’re only really working with the conscious brain. They’re not working With these automatic conditioned responses and reactions, especially the fight or flight ones, hmm, so that’s what I love about it if t we’re really getting to those fight or flight automatic reactions. It’s interesting, isn’t it? We, as adults, we think we make decisions and our choices based on our adult thoughts and sensors around us. But in fact, we really have little six year old running around making all sorts of decisions that may or may not work in adulthood. So yeah, it’s quite fascinating. It is and that’s one of the things that I teach people is to make sure that you find the core underlying belief and and the original memory that it came from. However, we’re not getting to that through conscious thoughts. We’re getting through it to work through the body feelings, the somatic reaction. So if we attempt to On a recent event, and obviously the recent events that are going on at the moment, kovan and we might be tapping on frustration and anger, or we might be tapping on you know, domestic violence that’s occurring and, and that belief that I always attract the wrong man or something like that, then we we will tap on a recent memory because our body our brains reaction, and that subconscious automatic reaction comes from a memory. And when we have a memory and experience, we input that through our senses, what we saw what we heard, what we smell, what we felt, and, and what we thought. So all of those, what we call aspects that come from a memory, then processed and then our brain in a split second. subconscious creates a conditioned response or reaction. Now those conditioned responses and reactions will cause one of two reactions. One’s the sympathetic nervous system fight or flight, cortisol, adrenaline. The other is the parasympathetic reaction of relaxation therapy. And the same part of the brain will chant either adrenaline cortisol or da ga, which is the cell repair hormone that the parasympathetic nervous system releases. So you can see if you’re in a chronic state of stress, or Yeah, a chronic state of stress or fight or flight response, and you’ve got adrenaline, cortisol pumping through your brain and through your body, then you don’t have the parasympathetic nervous system. Releasing d h EA, which is the cell repair hormone. So if you’re not in cell repair, and you’re in stress, you’re in what we call disobeys, and then you have the perfect environment to invite disease into your body. Which a lot of people particularly in Victoria, would be under enormous, enormous stress at the moment. I can’t imagine how you guys down there are coping with all of this. Mm hmm. Exactly. And there’s there is a lot of frustration, a lot of anger, a lot of grief and loss. A lot of when are we coming out of this? What’s, what’s the future? What you know, there’s so much unknown going on. Exactly. And helplessness and powerlessness. And not just grief and loss, but loneliness, you know, in my own situation, my grandma and I haven’t seen my two little grandchildren since April.

Molly Knight 10:00
Oh, gosh,

Jenny Johnston 10:02
No smoochy cuddly since then, sure we have FaceTime and thank God for technology and Zoom. But you know, it doesn’t replace the connection that you have when you see someone in person, huh? Yeah, exactly. And I guess in Victoria too, you have to wear masks all the time, don’t you? Mm hmm. So you don’t wear them in the house though. Hopefully they’re not that silly down the nose or in the car. However, you know, my neighbor came across the other day to give me something and she said, it’s ridiculous that I have to put on a mask to walk across the street.

Molly Knight 10:44
And it is ridiculous. Yeah, but I’m bearing the mask in itself apart from the physical damage breathing back in your, your carbon dioxide and any germs and we have thousands of germs in our mouth. Yeah, so re breathing That back into your lungs would put a physical and emotional stress on you, I would imagine.

Jenny Johnston 11:05
Mm hmm. Yes, definitely. So, yeah, there’s there’s a lot of my clients have have been very frustrated with the situation and I’m in Melbourne, I’m in Victoria. I mean, stage four locked down with a curfew, because apparently this disease is much stronger at night between 8pm and 5am.

Molly Knight 11:31
Very clever.

Jenny Johnston 11:32
It’s a very clever virus that gets very strong and it’s very dangerous at night. So we’re not allowed out. But anyhow, there’s, you know, what I’ve been trying to create with my clients and I’ve had depth tapping groups that are called tap and chat is about creating joy, like not only tapping about the frustration and the anger and what’s going on for them. and releasing it because that’s what the tapping does it, it helps to process the stresses and the emotions that are going on. And if you don’t process them and you push them down, what happens? You will get, you know, pushing down things that you can’t digest, you might get bowel cancer. You more, you know, you get a stiff neck and it’s it’s like, Who’s the pain in the neck for you at the moment? Well, at the moment ever running Victorians Dan Andrews, but you know, that’s what can happen is you will get stresses in the body. And one of the books that I really love actually is the secret language of your body by in a seagull and she’s, she’s actually Melbourne based but she teaches all around the world. But she gives all the metaphysical reasons behind what’s going on in your body. And, and what we do with EFT is look at where are you feeling it in your body? What’s going on? There, and then we relate it to a memory. When was the first time you felt this what was going on in your life? If it was something chronic it would be what’s going on what was going on in your life six to 12 months before this occurred. Because it takes a while for the body to to have the symptoms of something that’s chronic like Ms, or chronic fatigue. And it’s quite common for it’s quite common. I’ve heard that when there’s a real big trauma in your life a couple of years later, there’s often that cancer develops, and that’s fairly well studied them. Yeah, yeah. And adverse childhood traumas can also create problems in adulthood. So, you know, when I’ve worked with veterans with PTSD, you know, some some veterans who went through the same sort of experience, why did only some of them develop people TST and the other students, and the research shows that the ones that develop PTSD also had adverse childhood traumas. And so when I’ve worked with veterans with PTSD, it’s always When was the first one was another time you fell out When was the first time you failed, it always goes to childhood. And so that’s when we tap into all the aspects of that memory and the reactions in the body the reactions in their emotions. And we process it and release it so. So the actual physical tapping on these meridians systems and EFT Emotional Freedom Techniques has been explained also as like an emotional form of acupuncture but without the needles. So instead of putting needles into these meridian points, we’re tapping and sending a pulse through and that posts when we tuned into a traumatic or stressful movie, counter conditions that conditions stress response into one of relaxation. And how we measure that is often through the suns you know, what’s your subjective unit of distress? Where’s that emotion? What? Where is it in your body? What’s the emotion that you’re feeling it so it might be anger, I feel it in my chest. What’s that anger when you tune into that memory and it might be 10 out of 10. All right, and so as we’re tapping through all the meridian points will also stop and ask, okay, what’s that now and it might come down to five and so what we’re doing is we’re processing and releasing that that conditioned reaction of stress and cortisol, adrenaline, the stress fight or flight faint or there’s four of them now fight, flight, find and freeze. You know, sometimes people Freeze in reaction, and we might say where do you feel like they go on numb, I don’t feel it anywhere, I don’t feel like I’m in my body. And that can often happen to children who have very traumatic, abusive experiences, they, the way they cope is that they basically dissociate from the body. And so they don’t feel anything in their body. But we have Ways and Means and different techniques to work with that as well. So it’s about processing and releasing those traumatic feelings, emotions, and where they’re held in the body. So that then they can go to the memory and speak about it and not have any reaction in their body anymore. Because they’ve had that stress response that fight or flight, faint or freeze response because the body’s been protecting them in some way. And we need that protection!

Molly Knight 17:02
Absolutely. Like a safety net?

Jenny Johnston 17:04
Yeah, at the time it was required, but the body holds on to that the body, the brain is very good at generalizing. And so the brain goes on that was like that. We need to be in fight or flight and be prepared for something bad hear. Like, I just ran a four day workshop online for the first time everyone was online on zoom. And I worked with the lady in we worked on the bushfires. And she said, Every morning when I get up and look out my window, I just see black and every morning I’m really traumatized by seeing that and seeing how close it was. All right. And so we had to tap on that whole memory of you know, the last minute having to get out having to get our elderly father at you know, who’s got a broken back having all these things that you have to do in the last moment and the And you know, we think the body as we were tapping and going through this specific memories, what she saw, heard felt smelt all of that, thanking the body for protecting me, I needed that fight or flight response at the time, but it’s no longer required and I choose to release it and let it go. And then by the time we’d gone through all the aspects of it, she was able to recall the whole memory without any reaction. It was all just I’m just telling the story.

Molly Knight 18:29
That’s awesome, isn’t it? I mean, that’s life. is life changing? Yeah, it is.

Jenny Johnston 18:34
Yeah, totally. Totally. Yeah. Yeah. Because even watching you know, we’ve got the the fires in California at the moment that people are watching. Anyone can be really triggered by that. And when your body’s retriggered into fight or flight stress reaction, often what happens you don’t have de hga the cell repair hormone in your body. And if your body is not able to repair itself, you go into essays. Mm hmm. Yeah. It’s amazing, isn’t it? I am, I remember one case I had doing some work with a patient. And this patient had a phobia of spiders. So, so bad that he couldn’t even look at a picture. So I couldn’t he couldn’t look at the computer screen or in a book. And, and he was an executive in a big company, and I wanted to do some other work with him. And he said, Look, if you can get rid of this spider phobia, I’ll work with you on yours. Yes.

Molly Knight 19:36
So I gave him one session with about the spiders and he lost his phobia, one session, and he’d had it you know, this man’s in his? Yeah, like 40s. So I mean, it just it totally changed his life. I think, you know, like I say for me if t is one of the most amazing things that I’ve ever come across,

Jenny Johnston 19:56
and that’s why more and more, I’m training You know, I just had a clinical neuropsychologist, a massage therapist, a social worker, you know a lot more and more I’m training professionals who are looking also they’re looking for you know, the silver bullet for trauma and EFT is it. EFT uses all pieces and parts of us and really addresses that automatic reaction and response that plain talking about it and explaining well you know, your your father abused your mother because he abused he was abused when he was a child. You know, knowing and understanding this at a conscious level does nothing. But when you process the trauma of it all and the way it’s being held in the body, the emotions of it. Then when the client can tell you about that hole Medical experience with no emotion about it, the body and the brain doesn’t hold on to it anymore. It’s like if you went to the shops and bought milk, it’s not a traumatic experience, the brain forgets about it. Okay? But when you’ve got a traumatic experience and the brains going remember that be aware of that like warning, warning danger. And it’s on high alert, anything that’s similar to that brings up the same response. But when you release all of their reaction around that, all the triggers, and it’s just a story, and it’s not landing on them anymore, then they can be in a state of ease. And it’s so powerful. You know, most people that I train, they become addicted to we have to because they’re addicted to the reaction that their clients get. Because when you see when people whose lives are changed Because of traumas that have been the sort of they have a negative or a no a new response to it anymore. Whereas when it was there for them every day, every day it was there and their reaction and that does stuff to your body at a chronic disease level.

Molly Knight 22:23
Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, you, you’re right, it does. Um, so have you. I know we’re going to do a little hands on tapping away. So let’s, let’s jump in and do that. I’ll just say, Bobby Kelly from Ireland. Hi, Bobby, thank you for joining for joining us all the way from Ireland and Cileo  from the Philippines. Thank you. Really nice to have you with us.

Jenny Johnston 22:51
And Bobby I worked with personally and Cileo. I went to the Philippines this time last year and she did my Quantum EFT workshop also, lovely.

Molly Knight 23:02
Yeah. Good. Great to see you ladies here

Jenny Johnston 23:05
Yeah. So what I want to do is show all the points first so that the very first point is called the side of the hand point. Normally we tap with our dominant hand, but you can tap into the site because all the meridians crossover, they’re all linked. And all the meridians are linked to different organs and different emotions. So this is where we start with the side of the hand and that’s where we do what we call the setup statement. And I’ll explain that in a minute. The second point is the top of the head and it’s really the crown of the head where the hairs turn around, swirl around there. Then we have the start of the hairs of the eyebrow so either side, right on the start of the hairs of the eyebrow. Then we have the point at the corner of the eye. So it’s right on the bone at the corner there then the bone Under the pupil, then the bone, not the bone, the fleshy part under the nose. Yep, then the crease of the chin. So sometimes people when we say chin point, they’re tapping down here, but it’s actually the crease of the chin right under the lip. If you’re doing acupuncture, that’s the way the needle is going right there. And they are very specific these points. Then the collarbone point is where your collarbone comes across, and you feel the two little novels at the end of your collarbone. You come down slightly diagonally out about just over a centimeter or an inch when we’re working with Americans. Very little hollows there. And they’re there when we tap and so you can tap one side or the other, or sometimes I do both with fingers and thumb. And then the next point is about four inches, or how many millimetres under the armpit. For women, it’s usually at the bottom of the bra strap. And some people go across the body. Some people go and tap on the side. So they’re the main points. And if I show you my quickly my little poster that I showed

Molly Knight 24:07
yep, that’s a good,

Jenny Johnston 25:20
it’s got all the different points. So like under the eye is the endpoint of the stomach meridian. And that’s for anxiety under the nose is for feeling unsupported. The chin point is for feeling overwhelmed. The collarbone is for fear. So there’s a whole lot of different points and how they’re related to different different meridians. Like, the side of the eye is the gallbladder meridian. And different emotions with each point to Jenny. Yeah, sound a bit. Yeah, yeah. So they’re all different. But my poster if anyone I’m interested in finding out where you get that poster from, they can email me but I like to show clients that so that they don’t think they just banging on the body in silly places. We’re actually really on specific meridians and we’re putting a pulse through them instead of putting a needle. But it’s, it’s been shown by research that it has the same effect and when we’re talking about research, Dr. Peter Stapleton who’s the Associate Professor of bond University in Australia in Queensland, she’s written this book and gives you a lot of research about tapping the science behind tapping.

Molly Knight 26:41
Yeah, that’s good to know, isn’t it?

Jenny Johnston 26:44
Yeah. And another basically have tea books from empty universe, the manual. So what say if we had somebody who was feeling particularly Melbourne, feeling very frustrated and panic angry and feeling it in their chest or feeling it in their throat like I’ve got no voice. I can’t say anything we’re being told what to do. So, for example, it might be. So this is where we do the setup statement, even though I feel it. So if you could be my Echo, Molly, sure. Even though I feel really frustrated, even though I feel really frustrated, and I feel it 10 out of 10 in my chest, and I feel it 10 out of 10 in my chest, and I’m really angry and I feel helpless. And I’m really angry and I feel helpless. Like I’ve got no voice.

Molly Knight 27:40
Like I’ve got no voice

Jenny Johnston 27:42
and I feel that eight out of 10 in my throat,

Molly Knight 27:45
and I feel that eight out of 10 in my throat.

Jenny Johnston 27:48
I accept myself and how I feel

Molly Knight 27:51
except myself and how I feel.

Jenny Johnston 27:53
Even though I feel really frustrated right now. Even though I feel really frustrated right now. I feel that like a heaviness in my chest, and I feel that like a heaviness in my chest 10 out of 1010 out of 10. And I’ve got this frustration like I’ve got no voice.

Molly Knight 28:13
And I’ve got this frustration like I’ve got

Jenny Johnston 28:15
no voice, and I feel helpless. And I feel helpless. And I feel like eight out of 10 in my throat,

Molly Knight 28:22
and I feel eight out of 10 in my throat.

Jenny Johnston 28:25
I accept myself and how I feel.

Molly Knight 28:27
I accept myself and how I feel.

And we do this three times, even though I’ve got this anger and I feel it in my chest. Even though I’ve got this anger and I feel it in my chest, a heaviness in my chest eight out of 10 heaviness in my chest eight out of 10 and I know that was 10 out of 10 Sorry, I’m trying to remember what I said. And I’ve got this frustration and helplessness and I feel it my throat and I’ve got this frustration and this helplessness and I feel as human throat, eight out of 10.

eight out of 10.

Jenny Johnston 29:03
I accept myself and how I feel

Molly Knight 29:05
I accept myself and how I feel.

Jenny Johnston 29:09
When I think of all the things that are happening right now,

Molly Knight 29:14
when I think of all the things that are happening right

Jenny Johnston 29:16
now, especially in Victoria,

Molly Knight 29:19
especially in Victoria,

our curfews, our curfews are having to stay in lockdown and having to stay in lockdown. It’s really frustrating. It’s really frustrating. And I feel so helpless. And I feel so helpless.

Jenny Johnston 29:40
And I have this anger in my chest.

Molly Knight 29:43
And I have this anger in my chest.

And I have this helpless frustrated feeling in my throat and to have this helpless. I forgot what frustrated frustrated feeling a my throat my throat um angry. I’m so angry. I’m so frustrated. I’m so frustrated. Anger in my chest, anger in my chest. frustration and helplessness in my throat, frustration and helplessness in my throat. I feel like I don’t have a voice.

I feel like I don’t have a voice.

Jenny Johnston 30:20
Especially when I watch the news,

Molly Knight 30:22
especially when I watch the news.

Jenny Johnston 30:26
Especially when I think of my family,

Molly Knight 30:28
especially when I think of my family.

And how I haven’t seen my family and friends for so long. And how I haven’t seen my family and friends for so long. I feel so disconnected.

Feel so disconnected,

socially isolated, socially isolated,

Jenny Johnston 30:48
and I don’t know when it’s gonna win,

Molly Knight 30:51
and I don’t know when it’s going to end.

I feel frustrated. A feel frustrated. I feel angry. I feel angry. I feel helpless, I feel helpless. And I feel disconnected from my family and friends. And I feel disconnected from my family and friends.

Jenny Johnston 31:11
And I want to release this feeling from my body

Molly Knight 31:14
and the one to release this feeling from my body.

Jenny Johnston 31:17
Especially when I watch the news,

Molly Knight 31:19
especially when I watch the news.

Jenny Johnston 31:23
So that was sort of a general round, but what I would do if I was working with a client was was say, okay, when when have you felt that feeling in your chest and that feeling in your throat before? Oh, tell me of this specific moment in time that you felt that because as I said in the beginning, it’s in a memory and that we get these reactions. So what you saw what you heard what you felt, what you smelled, you know what you thought. It’s in this specific memory that that conditioned pattern is down like And so in your brain in your body in your emotions, and so you need to get to specific memories to counter condition that conditioned response Okay, so when you work one on one with a client it’s very specific to their emotions and they’re experienced this their memory. Mm hmm Of course when we’re tapping generally when we’re just trying to tap generally Yeah, yeah, I mean there’s a lot of levels to doing EFT isn’t there yet certainly. I think just for the the beginner or doing it yourself at home. Probably wouldn’t tackle really deep in you know, traumatic stuff yourself. You just get off even though I’ve got a headache Yes, it or a pain in me or so you do this three times since you say even though I’ve got this problem. And then you say I accept myself and how I feel. So you’re accepting that you’ve got this problem. And often people with problems they, they try to push on and soldier on and push it down. But all that does is keeps holding it in the body. And so what we want to do is actually bring it up, tune into it, and then can a condition that condition response into one of relaxation. So, if people have been depressed before, and they’re feeling very depressed with what’s going on, then it’s like, well, when do you feel depressed when I’m watching the news or when this happens or when that happens? And so you tune into that specific moment what they saw what they heard what they felt in the body, and we release it and then we go, When was the first time you felt that when I was a teenager and my grandfather died? I was really close to my grandfather. All right, let’s tap on that. Tell me what, what what part of when your grandfather died? Did you feel really depressed?

Molly Knight 33:59
Yeah. So If someone has that issue, but they don’t know when it occurred, they can’t really link it back. How do you work with that?

Jenny Johnston 34:08
The great thing is that when we start tapping on something that’s recent, or just have a feeling and I say Just be aware of what the subconscious brings up as to friend of mine when with a memory and, and the subconscious will always give them a memory. And as we’re tapping and then and then I’ll, I might see their eyes go somewhere too, which means that they’re, they’re finding a part of the brain is bringing up a memory. And I’ll say what just happened in you might might have frowned or your eyes might have gone somewhere. What what just happened, I just thought of, you know, this thing that happened when I was six, but that can’t be anything to do with it. I go if the subconscious has just brought that up, very relevant, tell me about it. And then we tap on that. So it may not initially appear to be linked, especially as an adult.

Yeah, and often people will say, oh geez, how did we get here? I you know, and I never thought this would be relevant. And you know, where we start with something recent or what’s going on will often go to places in childhood or teenage years or and they go wow, I never thought that this would have come up. You know, they’ve got no idea consciously that that was linked, but we’ve gone through the body and the cymatics and the subconscious has led us there. Yeah, you know, like if we were working on someone for public speaking, for example, it it will usually go back to having to present something you know, project or something in primary school or having to read something and kids laughing at your or saying the wrong answer. And you are being made to stand up the front and be embarrassed and humiliated. So, you know these memories that then go back to childhood where there’s there’s been embarrassment, humiliation you know what we might think as an adult was a small t trauma. It’s actually something being that was created as a conditioned reaction and response.

Molly Knight 36:28
Yeah, yeah, exactly. I mean, when you said that about public speaking my mind mmediately went to must have been about eight I guess, where I had to stand up and read something in class and I felt that in my body immediately, and I don’t have too many problems as an adult talking. But um, that was where I went. So yeah, that’s obviously something I should work with. Probably.

Jenny Johnston 36:52
Yeah. Call me tomorrow Molly. But what what I was going to say is that we’ve become I’m very used to using our brains and and our left brain and our consciousness and saying, push that down push it aside, but with EFT we tune into How are you feeling? were you feeling that in your body? And sometimes it takes people a while to get used to that. Let’s not have we taught to look at things at all. Yeah, yeah, so what might the opposite effect? Yeah, especially with guys too, but, you know, you know, men are often or boys and men are often told push it down, don’t feel that don’t be a sissy. But, you know, there’s there’s been a hell of a lot of men that have been very emotional in the work that I’ve done with them because the body takes them there to release those emotions and, and, you know, people will often say I didn’t expect to get so emotional and sometimes it’s, it’s just on the setup statement. They’ll start getting emotional and they’re going Oh, sorry, I didn’t I didn’t know. I didn’t expect that. And, and I often will say to people, I’m really good at making people cry. That’s what that’s what people often ask, What do I do? And I say, I make people cry, and I’m really good at it. But it doesn’t always.

Molly Knight 38:22
Not a good advertisement Jenn!

Jenny Johnston 38:24
It’s not. It’s it’s about processing stuff that’s been stuck in the body. Yes, for so long. You know, I remember one year actually, it was a Sydney workshop. And I had a guy and on the workshop, and he’d been in the army, and when I said about emotions and crying and stuff that comes up and he goes, I haven’t cried since I was six. And, within the first practice session, he was crying like a baby when we got to the six year old memory because they What it had had him stopped at that age because of a trauma that had happened. And so it’s amazing to unlock these things in people, and to allow them to also then look at, well, when this happened when I `was six, what’s the belief I created about myself in the world?

Molly Knight 39:19
Yeah, and how it impacts as an adult, isn’t it?

Jenny Johnston 39:22
Yeah. And then how can we shift and change them? What can we now create as a new belief now that we’ve released all the emotional reaction and all the trauma around that. And we can also be saying, you know, something recent is occurring, a pattern is occurring now. Because of that, we can say thanking my body for reacting the way my six year old did, but I no longer require this six year old reaction and pattern. Yeah, I’m a grown up now. I can release it and let it go. And as we’re tapping and see emulating the parasympathetic nervous system and the relaxation response, we’re releasing all of that trauma and creating a new way of being now. So it’s so powerful.

Molly Knight 39:39
It’s powerful and freeing. It’s, it’s wonderful. Like I said, I think EFT is up here. It’s at the top of the ladder of help and self help, because once your patients or clients learn to do it, you can do it. Anywhere, anytime. Yeah, by yourself.

Jenny Johnston 40:33
Yeah, and it is a simple technique to use and to learn, but it’s actually EFT is Emotional Freedom Techniques. There are a lot of techniques and when practitioners are working, particularly with clients and trauma. There’s lots of different techniques that we learn to take them there gently and to process it gently instead of dropping them straight into the terminal. Part of the trauma, the trauma capsule, as we call it. So we have lots of different techniques that I teach people to approach it and very gently and to, to not to not use like exposure therapy where suddenly they’re there in the trauma and and they having an experience that is traumatic again by reliving it and

Molly Knight 41:27
how some of the thought to therapies that talking therapies isn’t that Jen

Jenny Johnston 41:32
Yeah, they can drop people straight into a into a trauma capsule, where they’re still seeing, hearing it feeling and experiencing it in the present. Where the subconscious is pushed it down into a capsule saying don’t go there. But then suddenly, they brought into it. So we, I teach people how to recognize that there might be a trauma capsule and how to approach it gently And how to go to little piece by little piece by little piece. And just keep them in there and process just that little bit in that little bit in that little bit, but also to utilize some form of dissociation so that they’re not fully in the trauma. And I explain how they’ll get, they’ll get a wave of emotion but then we process it and that goes, and then we go to the next bit where we get a wave of emotion and we process it and it goes, so it’s not, let’s dump you in it and see how you go, which is what exposure therapy has been about. That Yeah, works for free. Here’s the emotional contributors to physical issues that works really well with you know, something like Tourette’s Jim does, could you do something with Tourette’s, only the stress around, you know, the emotional stress around as it contributed to it. That’s all we would be looking at. So if somebody is really stressed and you know, public place and thinking, oh my god, I’m going to be swearing or whatever and their stress levels are higher the adrenaline corazones properly contributing to the condition. So, you know, we can never say that EFT can work on anything, but I always say to my practitioners try it on anything and everything because, you know, research shows that the stress component is very high to a lot of conditions, and physical and emotional conditions. So, if we can release the stress component, then were allowing the body to heal itself and also EFT shows to increase your immune system. So, being able to work with your body to release traumas, To release dresses and to allow the hga the cell repair hormone to flood your system so that your body can heal itself, and to boost your immune system who wouldn’t want to be doing that? And often people say, I don’t know what to say. Like you said before. All you have to do is speak out loud what you’re feeling, even though I feel really bad today, you know, I and I’m really feeling it in my neck and my shoulders. I accept how I feel. I feel all this responsibility and burden. I feel it in my neck and shoulders, especially when I think about my business going downhill. And I’m supposed to be feeding my family. I’m supposed to be the man of the house. I feel emasculated. You know, whatever they they’re saying I say, sit in front of the mirror and imagine you’re speaking to your best friend and just say out loud how you’re feeling and tap through the points and you’ll feel a shift And things just come, don’t they? The subconscious just brings things to you. Yeah, of course, if there is big traumatic stuff, you’re better off working with someone else and a trained practitioner and I train. I’ve been training practitioners since 2011. And then I also said, help people become certified practitioners. So if people really want to add EFT to their, their, their tool belt, then yeah, let me know and I can put you in the right direction to training in this properly.

Molly Knight 45:43
Yeah, we’ll, once we finish our little chat. We’ll make sure we’ve got all your links so people can connect. I know, certainly, I’ve seen some amazing things with EFT over the years. years and it’s um, I don’t think I’ve seen anything that it hasn’t helped. I’m not saying cured. Yes, I’m in physical terms, I guess but helped. Yes. And that’s that’s a gift.

Jenny Johnston 46:15
Oh, it’s it’s, it is it’s um yeah, I guess it’s sometimes I’ve explained it. You know, if if you saw somebody with an infection and you had penicillin, wouldn’t you want to give it to them? You know, it’s like, it’s like, we’ve got this magical tool that you want to be able to give to people and the kids, you know, kids in the classroom. Peter Stapleton has an online training called tapping in the classroom. So more and more schools are using EFT. I’ve worked with veterans with EFT I’ve worked with so many people. I had a lady on one of my courses recently who developed a migraine after we watched a A video about veterans and one veteran was saying how he was pulling pieces and parts of people out from underneath the rubble. And all of a sudden her mind went to her son in the Christchurch earthquake. And she knew he was in Christchurch somewhere. When they finally found him, he was covered in ash and blood. And then the memory of him telling her that he was pulling out pieces and parts of people. And just that trigger of seeing that, that film clip, or just those words, center into a migraine and in our workshop, and she said, that’s it. I’ll be out for two or three days now, I won’t be able to do the rest of this. And so she laid down in the dark, we went out to lunch, came back, and it was tapping for physical issues. So I tapped with her for all of that. Within 20 minutes. My grandma was completely gone. Yeah, it’s it’s like a miracle. It really is. You I love EFT as you can tell I keep rabbiting on about it. So I, so I wouldn’t be teaching it and working in the field. All these years later if I didn’t believe totally in it. Yeah. Well, you um, I mean, you deal with a lot of trauma cases. So you’d see a lot of deep things. Like I remember once you were telling me about a case where a chap had seen someone actually murdered. Can you talk about that? Because I think that he had had he’d watched his girlfriend being murdered and his Auntie trained with me and she said, Do you think you could help him because he wasn’t coping with life. He was angry. He was on drugs. He was not working. He was seeing psychiatrists psychologists had gone catatonic afterward, he was in a really bad way. And this is a you know, a young Guy early 20s and the our work through that whole thing doing what we call them movie technique tell the story and we do piece by piece by piece and it was it was pretty horrific I had to do some tapping myself afterwards it was it was full on

Molly Knight 49:17
Yes. I can understand that

Jenny Johnston 49:19
But you know he’s he’s out there in society working got a girlfriend you know doing what normal guys doing now and that wasn’t what was going to be foreseen for him.

Molly Knight 49:34
Yeah, absolutely. How many sessions did that take you to work through all that Jen?

Jenny Johnston 49:40
Two very long ones

Molly Knight 49:41
huh okay well that’s not a lot that’s not a lot is it and he’s got his life back.

Jenny Johnston 49:48
Yeah particularly for for people who have a traumatic memory. It’s really good if their lives been affected because of one traumatic memory. Yeah. if you can go and unpack that traumatic memory what you saw what you heard what you felt. It’s absolutely brilliant.

Molly Knight 50:07
Yeah, yeah, that’s amazing. One of the little things that I do personally, with EFT is when I go into the supermarket and I have to head down the aisle with has all the washing powders and the chemicals, I get a headache from the chemical smells. So all I do is I’m pushing my trolley I just tap here. As I walk down, grab what I need and I’m okay. Yeah, so it’s amazing just igniting those acupuncture points. Well, that meridian just changes how your body responds,

Jenny Johnston 50:42
yeah. And there’s finger points too. So sometimes, you know the bed of the nail of the thumb. And then the fingers are the ones closest to you the bed of the nail closest to you. There are also finger points that you can do so, you know, kids often chew the quick of their thumb that century, they’re actually stimulating a relaxation response because they’re stressed. But you know, you can tap it instead, or tap it with your fingers instead of chewing on it. There’s finger points as well. And there’s something that we call the nine gamma point. So this point in between the little finger and the ring finger, there’s about a centimeter there’s a hollow there, the nine, the nine gamma point when you’re tapping that and then doing different II movements. It’s basically like a search and destroy where’s this memory contained in my brain and let’s find it and process it and release it. So there’s, there’s nine movements where we keep our heads still we close our eyes, open our eyes, while we’re focused on the memory. We look hard down to the left, hard down to the right Then circle their eyes slowly in one direction in a big circle and circle your eyes slowly in the other direction. Then we have happy birthday. Mm hmm. count to five first fast 12345 and hum Happy birthday. Mm hmm. What that does is it scans the left brain for counting fast the right brain for music and humming and the eye movements are scanning all parts of the brain for where is this memory held? So might seem a bit silly, but there’s science behind it. And mazing I just ran a workshop online for four days and nearly every person that I did a demonstration with they said are really shifted when we did the nine gamma point line yet, after we did all the points yet it came down but but the big Whammy was the nine gallop point that seemed to clear at all So, as so many different techniques to master it, is why we certify people is in this and train them properly. Yeah, a lot of depth, a lot of different ways that you can work with it. And with children. I mean, I know kids love it and you can work with children, but like, could you do an online consult with a child for that? Yeah, I’m working with a 16 year old at the moment, her mom’s always there as well. I’ve worked with eight year olds, I worked with my my author’s son in America, and he was very insightful kids or kids are amazing. You just use their words. You keep it brief, and yeah, they they clear quite quickly.

Molly Knight 53:51
Mm hmm. So can I ask what I’m given that you’re in your lockdown and The worlds online now so if you’ve got some courses coming up Jen some like the courses we’ve got coming up.

Jenny Johnston 54:07
And so basically I work with anyone online I use Zoom online, and I always have but EFT Universe is who I’m a trainer with and I just ran the four day professional EFT training online. The next one I’m doing that is not till next year, April, the eighth to the 11th. But if you go to EFT, and then go to workshops, it will show you what workshops are coming up around the world. The other EFT universe trainer that I’ve just trained is Naomi Jansen, and she’s in New South Wales and she’s about to do an online workshop, late September. So she’d be the first one that’s coming up and then there’s others in America that are doing them. It would be a different time. But to Australia, but they are available. And then I also teach quantum EFT.

Molly Knight 55:09
This is the thing that you’ve developed, isn’t it with all your knowledge and learning over the last, you know?

Jenny Johnston 55:18
Yeah, the spiritual background and all of the things I’ve learned and, you know, most people believe in reincarnation. With EFT we were always looking for the origin of where did this come from? with quantum e of t. We’re looking at working in time and space, but also looking at who are we as a soul? Why is my soul got this lesson in this lifetime? And usually it’s come from other lifetimes. And it’s repeated in this lifetime because it hasn’t been completed yet. It hasn’t been hailed. We haven’t stepped through it. And so I’m very sorry. Yeah, I create a quantity of tea and my first book tapping into past lives. And the second book when I did two American tours, with workshops, your past life inheritance. Yeah, so I run those workshops and we look at where does this come from originally? And what’s my soul learning and lesson? What’s my sole purpose? It’s very much about what’s going on a soul level. And how is that influencing me now in my life now.

Molly Knight 56:32
So if you if you didn’t have that belief, or you didn’t want to go to that depth, you don’t have to you still get awesome results. Just resolving the here and the now really, in this lifetime?

Jenny Johnston 56:47
Yeah, but I do use the words when I’m tapping with people releasing this all the way back towards origin. And wherever that wherever that may be, and actually it was in one of the cities workshops when I was staying with you, Molly in Sydney, and we were running level one, level two, back then it was now it’s the four day professional. And there was a guy there who had abandonment issues. And, and he didn’t believe in past lives and we were doing clinically fit. But I said, let’s just say releasing it all the way back to its origin wherever it began. And he was happy with that, because he just wanted this released. And we’d gone back through childhood stuff in all the way back to birth. Right, but it was still there. So when it’s still there, and he’s saying things like, I feel like it’s always been there. That’s a hint for me that it’s come from other lights. Anyhow, we’re tapping and all the way back to its origin. And then he was very emotional and crying and saying, I’m an Aboriginal, and I’ve had the bone pointed at me and that community has cast me out of the community to go out in the bush and die alone.

Molly Knight 58:05
Oh my goodness.

Jenny Johnston 58:06
And he was really emotional. He could feel it. He was crying and then his conscious brain would kick in he goes, but I’m not a past life kind of guy like what’s going on? And then, but I’m an Aboriginal one, all the emotions would come back again. People don’t have to believe these. Another example was again in Sydney when I was running the workshop with someone and they were tapping back to the origin and then in the practice session, the the person being the practitioner said, Where are you now? And she said, I’m in the Vatican. And the lady doing the practice, she’s like, looking at me like a deer in the headlights going, what do I do? And I said, just ask her where are you feeling? Or what’s the emotion What’s going on? It’s a memory. You just treat it like a memory. Where are you feeling that in your body? What’s the emotion one is it out of 10 but people will spontaneously go to past `lives whether you believe it or not.

Molly Knight 59:03
Hmm, okay. Okay. Yeah, interesting. Right. Well, there we go. So, I, I am, I suggest, if you have issues, please learn to do tapping. Do you use any of Gary Craig’s work? I know he’s got a great website Jen and a lot of stuff’s free to download.

Yeah, no I use EFT universe and EFT universe has a lot of free videos as well. But particularly over all my years of running workshops, I’ve got demonstrations from those workshops and people that have allowed them to be videoed and viewed and I’ve got over 400 free EFT videos under different categories.

Oh gosh, that’s a lot.

Jenny Johnston 59:57
Yeah, on on YouTube. Yeah. called EFTAustralia one word is my YouTube channel. And I’ve got playlists like grief and loss EFT for cravings EFT for physical issues EFT using the gentle techniques EFT for PTSD. You know there’s EFT using the movie technique where I said we do piece by piece. So I’ve got lots of different categories there that people can go and look them up and say, Well how do I do this? And I’ve also got a quantum EFT workshop which website which is quantum ef And I’ve got a quantum EFT playlist on my YouTube channel. And I am running a quantum e of t workshop online October 24 25. Okay, okay. So do you have to have any basic training learn to do EFT before you do your quantum one? No, you can just jumping. Yeah, I usually ask people to watch some of the videos or if they feel like it to do a session with me or private session before we do it so that they experience that for themselves.

Molly Knight 1:01:13
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Okay.

Jenny Johnston 1:01:17
And one of the things, especially for all your listeners, is that from now till the end of the year, if anyone does want to work with me, they can do it at concession price, not for price. Okay, okay.

Molly Knight 1:01:30
That’s that’s marvelous, Jen. I mean, I can’t recommend you more. I know, you’ve helped my husband heaps over the years, and I’ve certainly worked with you to my great benefit. So if anybody you know, is interested, please contact Jenny and have a session. I mean, I’ve seen profound change in people just in one session. Yeah. So it’s not like it’s going to be you know, every week for, you know, yeah.

Jenny Johnston 1:01:59
But then they’re, There are people who do need longer term stuff for chronic things. But yeah, it can be surprising what gets shifted in an hour.

Molly Knight 1:02:10
Yeah, absolutely. I couldn’t agree more. All right on that note, Jen, I’d like to thank you so much for joining me tonight its been very interesting and informative. And

Jenny Johnston 1:02:21
Thank you Molly, my pleasure. And Mike who’s behind the scenes.

Molly Knight 1:02:28
Thanks, Jenny. It’s um, it’s It has been a pleasure. Thank you for all your information and your generous offer for the public its marvellous.

Jenny Johnston 1:02:36
No problem. Thanks for having me. Great to see you again.

Molly Knight 1:02:39
You to I hope you get to see your grandchildren soon.

Jenny Johnston 1:02:43
Me too.

Molly Knight 1:02:45
Alright everyone good night from Health Australia Party. Thank you for joining us and if you want to have some EFT whether you’ve got something physical or emotional, you know, contact Jenn and I’m sure she’ll be able to help you in some ways, and Health Australia Party, we’re doing our best to bring lots of interesting information to people. To help us all through this journey. We’re in a very interesting time. It’s quite amazing to be alive right now really. And we all need all the help we can get. So help support Health Australia Party people, please join us and, and help us make sure that we have a good voice for natural health care in this country. Thanks, everyone. Good night.



Dr Peter Eng joined us on Thu 3rd September 2020 to discuss the effects of mould on your health. In the Facebook Live discussion, Dr Eng covered why mould has become such a big problem, the health risks associated with exposure, treatment options and solutions that can help keep your home and body mould free.


Dr Eng is a General Practitioner who specialises in nutritional medicine. In 2003 he was awarded a centenary medal by the Governor-General of Commonwealth of Australia for contributions to Australian society and was made a Fellow of Australia College of Nutritional and Environmental Medicine (ACNEM)

Click on the image below to watch the complete interview:

The transcript from our automated service is now available below. (E&OE)

Molly Knight 0:00
Good evening, everyone. Welcome to Health Australia Party on Mali. Tonight I’m talking to Dr. Peter Ainge. doctoring is a medical practitioner with over 55 years of experience, and he specializes in integrative and complementary medicine and integrative oncology. He’s a fellow of the Australian College of nutritional and Environmental Medicine. And the next board member of AC n e. m. Dr. ng has received the Australian Centennial medal for his contribution to Australian society. He’s an active fundraiser for the National Institute of integrative medicine. And he’s got many, many awards. He’s done so much. I’ve got to four pages of everything that he’s done and it’s an enormous career. doctoring operates from his surgery based in middle park with a vision for his patients to To improve their health and well being, by the practice of integrative medicine, backed by the latest in global clinical studies using trusted, safe and proven vitamin, herbal and supplements support. Welcome, Dr. ng thank you for joining us tonight. Molly, thank you for having given me the opportunity to come spring online tonight and I believe we’re going to discuss about the illness arising from folks living water damage home. Yeah. So can begin. Can you? Can you just tell me you’ve got such a varied career. Can you tell me how you became so interested in the environmental aspects and mold and causing problems with people? How did you get involved in this?

Dr Peter Eng 1:55
Yes, well, my son built the home in house And some 10 years ago, and when it rained, the water used to come on the walls and use of a bucket to catch the water coming down from the light fittings. And it’s awful. That then that tended a metagenics me seminar. And one of the papers presented was from Dr. Cameron Jones and my college is talked about this illness that arises in families living homes that that death and what the damage and then I told my son about it because they’re all sick with fatigue, memory loss, joint pain, diarrhea, abdominal pain, headaches, asthma, and the tomoson. Your home has to be audited by Cameron Jones. He did not believe me. And then I went to another metagenics seminar two years ago. And put my foot down and said, Look, you love the guitar. And I’m getting more and more stress. Yeah. And he had the audit and he found that the home was worth the damage full of moles, though. Then I had the patient go, whew Morgan from Western mining, and he told me about a parliamentarian from Canberra called Lucy Wickham, who had multi system symptoms like those so my family, and she found a doctor shopping from one specialist to another, and the end in the end he found a doctor that had knowledge of integrative medicine, and diagnose her as having suffering from a condition called chronic inflammatory response syndrome. Multi system multi organ disease arising from living water damage home and social media. That is Parliament inquiry that was released by the Commonwealth Government a year and a half ago in which the report came out that one in two homes are water damage. Remember, a lot of patients who live in such homes had the multi system multi symptom disease. Yeah. So I have been using the so opening line to encourage my patients to think about this, this or that now, this disease is not well known. Unfortunately, mainstream doctors are not trained in asking patients a simple question. Have you ever lived in a home this water damage because this patient’s good doctor shopping with multi system headaches, joint pains, chronic fatigue, sore muscles, installment depression, anxiety, abdominal pain, Esma and sometimes the doctors say is all in the hip, take some antidepressants other and sothat is why have taken an interest in seeing patients with multi multi symptoms. They come they hear about me and usually I’ve seen many doctors and the first question I asked them when they tell me about the symptoms, yeah, is heavy Eben live in a water damage show that is so big, huge public health issue. If you say that one in two homes in Australia water damage, and one four of Australians have got a type of gene on chromosome crows chromosome six, nine genes and they belong to a family of HLA dr dq that poor group of patients have a inability to deal with exposure to buy toxins arising from exposure to what’s the dimensions containing fungus fungus? Yeah. And this group of patients, then, when I see them, I would order I would give them a ticker history, the physical examination, and then we then begin the journey to confirm they suffer from this biotoxin illness because they have this nasty set of genes. Yeah, actually good. So, so I begin by checking your urine for mycotoxins. So if the urine shows the presence of a flat toxin, now that’s dangerous because it’s linked to liver cancer. Very common for where it comes from Malaysia. Because in Malaysia, the formulas it seemed peanuts the most, and they don’t finish the big Bag of stainless and they lived in a kitchen three days late and they eat and roughly one in five to six patients that they used to look up the in the water in Malaysia in hospital and liver cancer. And my gosh, that’s high. Yeah. And my chief medicine, Dr. Lim said the question of this patient of liver cancer the poor Malays, do they like steamed peanuts and everyone will say we’ve eaten see steamed peanuts from young they were full of a flat toxin of the skin Aqua toxic exposure for mold and testlink to mainstream General Studies, bladder cancer and dementia, the kidneys to be hypertension. Yeah. So when patients come to see me they usually present with chronic fatigue. The communists complained the head. I’ve been tired from the day wake up for last six months, a year, two years. Yeah. And then To do a symptom list which is here at 37 symptoms, this the most frequent symptom still seeing patients suffering from chronic inflammatory response syndrome from living in what’s the dimensions most a lot of patients are not aware that the homes are worth the damage. All they need is a small little hole in the roof and the water with heavy rain with two years, heavy rain come put onto the ceiling insulation gets moist most granddam they let go of spores which come down the space of light fittings and you breed them. So my family, they are very sick, my son in fact, my son used to be head of climbing Swiss with a team of 11 and suddenly suddenly he couldn’t remember what his CEO had said to him the previous day our instructions given to him so Mr. frightening illness yeah mmm the them when they go shopping when patients like this go to see one specialist for headaches for example assume neurologist and and but they go all the other symptoms yeah they’re just giving headache pills yeah other seat you’re neurotic its is all in the head So it’s frightening.

Molly Knight 9:25
It is very frightening yeah and could be part of dementia as well Peter do you think?

Dr Peter Eng 9:30
Is this a study by Professor Dale Bredesen from the University of California tennis lectures and his his paper he published paper they say the one in three patients in homes for Alzheimer’s. The underlying causes of most Yeah, and mycotoxins in the one in three will walk home and have dinner with the grandchildren children. This the mainstream published study

Molly Knight 10:00
Yeah, yeah, that’s frightening.

Dr Peter Eng 10:02
neurologists this country give our set of patients with early Alzheimer’s works for years and they say goodbye. They’re good the nursing home and you will leave your family worries when they walk out long string good last year is yes. Okay. So in the diagnosis of mold illness, I do the urine test first, then and for the genes Yeah, initially Dr. dq, so if the positive that confirms that they suffer from SIRs resulting from this set of genes where the immune system does not know how to get rid of the mycotoxins, so reinforce the population, which do not have this set of genes, the immune system can bind them up and kick them up by production of antibodies, but those who have this massive set of genes in HLA dq Dr. The innate immune system will meet up with a biotoxin and and try and present it to the antigen presenting cells to the T cells to form antibodies, but with this set of genes, the antigen presenting cell would not accept these the signal from the immune system the immune system. So, this point immune cells from the innate immune system which you get from birth, they keep on producing inflammatory cytokines to try and get the batasia into the antigen presenting cell we shall not accept them. So, this increase in inflammatory cytokines and so, the diagnosis we do for damage to the immune system Yeah, from this cytokines are mainly immune system. So, this So, a so once we identify all the markets for you News for producers. They include the script enkel best transforming growth factor beta one is mellow mostly signaling factor. So these are all the positives. Sorry it’s my wife, I just take it. Okay, thanks, sir. That’s

Molly Knight 12:24
Thats OK never hang up on the wife.

Dr Peter Eng 12:29
I did tell I had to talk about TV. So, once we confirm they have got this market for biotoxin illness we also have to do a market swap of the nose. Why? Because when you breathe in the spores into nostril and the produce the mycotoxins, we wish go up the olfactory nerve. Yeah, and the trigeminal nerve into the brain. Yeah, yeah. That’s what the cognitive decline, memory loss loss of vision can focus and find can’t find words. Yeah. Shocking. Yeah. So the treatment then we tell a patient says leave, get out of the home with what the damage have an audit done by mycologist. I normally recommend Dr. Cameron Jones. He’s a PhD in psychology. Secondly, once he finds out which part of the home is worth the damage, then you have a scope of works to remediate the water damage home. So the scope of work must be done separately from the remediated. So there’s no confl`ict of interest then of all the leaks in the roof or the base. And then once it’s done then I will now clear the moulds out of you. Yeah, so give them colloidal silver to kill the moulds and the mark of Mark consists of multiple antibiotic resistant coagulase negative Staphylococcus aureus is a nasty bug that antibiotics will not kill, because the most former by biofilm to protect the staff. So no matter what antibody is used use it can get through well got a spray Colloidal Silver containing gentamicin and to clear them within a month to spray into nostril three times a day. Then I tell my patients to take a binder the binders call polystyrene, which cardiologists will use when the patient has got such a high cholesterol level that the Lipitor the prescribed or the stet in the prescribed will not lower them. The binds the lipids yet but it also binds mycotoxins so not producing producible moles are stored in bile bi L. Produced by liver cells and stored in the gallbladder. So I tell my patients take your binder couristan within half an hour before you eat, because it gives time to the colostomy to go down the esophagus the stomach in the duodenum. And when they eat the gallbladder contracts and squeezes the bile in the common bile duct introduced in them, and then your binders will catch them and then pack them up. So usually, within two months normally provided the whole history of molds. Yeah, that the binders and you become a new person, huh? Yeah. Would you get your life back, wouldn’t you? Peter, doesn’t matter if you’ve had your gallbladder removed. How does that affect the process to produce bile? The microbes stored in bile? Yeah, then they would be. I don’t know why we have a gallbladder. We don’t need it.

Molly Knight 15:57
Lots of people don’t these days

Dr Peter Eng 16:04
So, the other way that the important thing is that when the patient has got a service, we need to do a MRI of the brain is called neuro quant Yeah. And in most certain sections of the brain swollen and certain parts of a trophy compared to normal MRI brain. So this neural quantities used by the United States Air Force because patients with biotoxin illness, this this lack of blood supply to the optic nerve. So when we do a testicle, visual contrast sensitivity with color patterns, those suffering from stress will will not be able to we’ll miss certain colored sections. So you can have pilots they can see properly. Yeah, exactly. Proof test, visual contrast, only a $25 test online. So when they take patients of the month and get them to repeat the visual contrast, and if I click the moles, One Two months later, the visual contrast comes back. They can see on the color patterns, they initially they couldn’t see. So, yeah, so you have this a in this group of patients that could not believe know that all this for five years has suffered and been vilified by specialists to say some of them are Satan’s all in the mind. Yeah, in essence, shocking, shocking. So this is the paper we share with you. Why don’t physicians acknowledge this illness? Yeah. So it says, typically, education is offered to physicians in a medical training on this subject. There is poor understanding of me Many, even contentful the concept that our environment is capable of slowly poisoning its inhabitants. Yeah. So say SEO. Occasionally and variable illness becomes national news overnight. Legionnaires disease. Yeah. But more typically, a few individuals discovered the toxic potential of a substance called asbestos published and yet it may take three, four decades for public and Western doctors to accept that. Yeah, okay. Yes, exactly. Yes, this delay is widespread. This delay in widespread awareness of novel science is not new, and was certainly around at the expense of Copernicus, Galileo and others who series improves your poser powerful controlling bodies. So why do why why do the Society not accept by toxic illness because this money yeah. company do not know about this illness because the is chronic. Yeah. And they got the payout insurance payments to sick patients or the big businesses to repair the water damage commercial building. So funny, though. So they employ marketing tools similar to what the tobacco industry used to do. They knew the tobacco industry knew in their own studies that smoking can cause lung cancer. Yeah, for 20 3040 years. They came up denying it. Yeah, until that took them that long. Yeah. So similarly.

Molly Knight 19:51

Dr Peter Eng 19:52
That’s the insurance companies. They use misinformation Yeah. To doubt` that, you can inhale something and not get and get ill it is a scandal. It is

Molly Knight 20:11
it is scandalous. Yes.

Dr Peter Eng 20:13
So, the in the United States, the there are a lot of doctors in Australia some doctors that do the cause by Dr. Schumacher, who is the the doctor who actually discovered that by by toxin can cause serious illnesses here. And if you pass the Shu Marcus, certified course, then you’re trained to treat patients suffering from sirs. Yeah. So if there any questions, anyone likes to ask, just maybe speak to you.

Molly Knight 20:56
Got a few questions coming through. So Well, let’s have a look. Um, someone has Rebecca has asked about children. Have you treated children and what were the children’s symptoms and the recovery rate?

Dr Peter Eng 21:12
Yeah, so you might want granddaughter Yeah, I’ve got three granddaughters and Libyan because with SIRs this auto immune disease very common. So my granddaughter Libby has got a little Lego bit Lego with white precious yeah and I give just because I met the builder kit my son $2.5 million because V cadherins do and the pay my son 2.5 so they move the new home. So I told my son I’m going to start treating lippie now that she’s in a Morphe home. Yeah, yes. The live in Docklands also moves you believe it. I bought the apartment for Got the gift out of the water who, when they move in within a month people move. So they’ve moved into a home so hopefully I start with him next week. Yeah, it means

Molly Knight 22:13
How old is she Peter. How old is your granddaughter?

Dr Peter Eng 22:16
10 years old.

Molly Knight 22:17
Ten. Okay. All right.

Dr Peter Eng 22:20
But it was from age 5. Big from age 5. Shocking. Yeah. And

Molly Knight 22:27
Did he have any other symptoms like any emotional stuff or

Dr Peter Eng 22:33
Yeah attention deficit? hyperactive activity fatigue. Yeah. Yeah. wouldn’t eat. Yeah. It’s shocking. Yeah. my grandpa’s granddaughters asthma fatigue. Yeah. Sometimes memory loss, joint pain. Hmm. Second one has got insomnia, fatigue, joint pains. So but they be fine once I start treating them because they’re now in our home.

Molly Knight 23:03
It’s mould free here. And it’s quite a quick response. Isn’t it? A couple of months. That’s

Dr Peter Eng 23:08
one two months. Two months. Yeah.

Molly Knight 23:10
That’s amazing. Because I know people can be ill for years, literally years. Doctor shopping as you call it. Looking for an answer. Yeah. Um, Eva, Eva said, is a contrast dye that used for the MRI is the MRI done with a contrast?

Dr Peter Eng 23:34
Yes. Yeah. The different dye called gadolinium which of course, if you have too many, it will affect your brain cells. Right.

Molly Knight 23:44
Okay. So not too many. Yeah.

Dr Peter Eng 23:47
Yeah. But But if patients don’t want to have it done, that’s fine. Because the clinical history in presentation, you can actually say, yeah, from the urine tests, and from the biomarkers for mood illness that the patient is having. Having cognitive decline at home epilepsy or inability to focus on this we call it the brain on fire is neuro commission wanting to patients exposed to most with the genes that the massive genes have got the brain problems depression anxiety what friends

Molly Knight 24:35
suicide Peter do you think that would be indicated

Dr Peter Eng 24:39
Suicidal my son

Molly Knight 24:42

Dr Peter Eng 24:43
my son. Yeah was suicidal

Molly Knight 24:47

Dr Peter Eng 24:49
it can be coming to say with the children, but he lost his job is hit the plumbing supply chain in Swiss, you know $300,000 instead He couldn’t remember what the CEO told him yesterday. But because he loved the good work. They said take a year off. We’ll pay you just turn up three times a day. Very good. House fixed up. Yeah. And so now

Molly Knight 25:13
That’s very kind. Yeah, that’s

Dr Peter Eng 25:15
it. Yeah.

Molly Knight 25:18
Peter, here’s another one. Um, Karen asks, Does a humidifier, a dehumidifier work at all? Are you taking the moisture out of the air? Would that do anything positive?

Dr Peter Eng 25:30
So humidity, we’ve tried to limit it to 30 to 50%. Yeah. The mould will start to grow, so there’s no harm dehumidify but more importantly, you should get the HIPAA filter.

Molly Knight 25:47
Okay. Yeah. So a dehumidifier you can buy to take the moisture out of the air that would be a benefit.

Dr Peter Eng 25:54
Yeah, yeah.

Molly Knight 25:55
Okay. All right.

Dr Peter Eng 25:57
The damp doesn’t get removed.

Molly Knight 25:59
Yeah,yeah, yeah, just get some moisture out here. Suzanne asks, have you got a protocol to follow that she can take to the doctor? She has many health issues due to toxic black mold poisoning. On the Sunshine Coast.

Dr Peter Eng 26:18
Yes, definitely on the Sunshine Coast. You go and see Dr. Sandeep Gupta, the mouldexpert of Australia.

Molly Knight 26:25
Oh, okay. On the Gold Coast,

Dr Peter Eng 26:27
for sure. Mark of the Sunshine Coast. Okay. Also, Dr. Sandeep Gupta s a n d. Double e P. Sandeep Gupta. Ji up ta Gupta.

Molly Knight 26:41
Awesome. Yeah, okay.

Dr Peter Eng 26:43
This my family, a country so when my kids was I flew him down on the Sunday paid him $5,000 a country my family and said, Look, prepayment treatment plan. And so we have got the history so family doctor In terms of my grandchildren my son

Molly Knight 27:04
Yes, yeah, exactly. All right. Um Christy asks, How do dead mould spores affect our body?

Dr Peter Eng 27:12
Say that again?

Molly Knight 27:15
How do dead mould spores affect the body?

Dr Peter Eng 27:20
Oh yes. So dead mould spores are more dangerous and mould

Molly Knight 27:24
Oh, why is that Peter?

Dr Peter Eng 27:26
Because it’s a toxic is toxic it is a toxic metabolite. Yeah and damage itself. Yeah, yeah, that’s worse. Yes. So when you breathe in the water damage home. Still the includes did the cell membrane of dead fungus. This is very allergenic.

Molly Knight 27:46
Huh? Okay, okay. Gosh, um, Can you recommend a HEPA filter? Is there any particular filter that you like?

Dr Peter Eng 27:56
We got HEPA filters in my home, and my son’s homes. The one speed in Switzerland cost about three $4,000. But year or two then change your filter.

Molly Knight 28:08
Okay, okay. Yeah.

Dr Peter Eng 28:11
The HEPA filter made in Switzerland,

Molly Knight 28:13
Switzerland, are they available in Australia?

Dr Peter Eng 28:17
We got them. We got ours from New Austin Hospital in Heidelberg.

Molly Knight 28:25
Heidelberg. Okay. All right. Yeah. So the dead mould spores are worse. All right. I’m just going to put a picture up here from a patient that I had seen quite a few years ago. I just want to show everybody if you can see that. There’s a mushroom growing behind her bedroom door. She didn’t realize it was there. And this patient is very ill. Yes, when they pull the wall off all the time. was the

Dr Peter Eng 29:01
Get out of that home as quickly as possible.

Molly Knight 29:05
Yeah. And what what do you Well, if you can’t get out of the home then obviously you have to get that person into evaluate the moulds and then rendered did it? remediate. So that could become a pretty expensive from

Dr Peter Eng 29:22
Yeah so I you looking at 10s of thousands of dollars. Yeah. And after remediation, you need to have the home re-tested.

Molly Knight 29:36
Okay to make sure it’s all gone. Yeah. Okay, so what um, you do your urine tests and your nasal swabs.

Dr Peter Eng 29:48
We do blood tests for bloods, markers for damage to cells in the body and to the immune system. So they include tumor buying clothes the transforming growth factor, beta one it comes in twos HGH includes the MMP nine but all these markets will tell you what if he got yet then the MMP is race so if it’s up to impact transforming growth factor when risk of autoimmune disease Yeah, only disease is an actual motor this of thyroid gland, your lupus, celiac disease yeah sjogrens disease vitiligo shocking. Yeah.

Molly Knight 30:39
I mean, it’s, it’s almost everything, everything wrong. Basically can have a link a definite link to mould.

Dr Peter Eng 30:49
A lot of them. Yeah. A symptom good. underlying cause I tell my patients simple story, we go fishing with the family in Port Phillip Bay on the bridge. Sunday, and suddenly there’s a leak at the bottom of boat. And water is gushing in is no point. The four of you getting buckets to throw the water out. It takes 10 years you still gushing water. So with no point treating a patient with cognitive decline, memory loss, you got to get rid of moulds first, then we can get the twins to improve memory. Yes. Yeah. You know, all those. Yeah.

Molly Knight 31:27
Yeah. So, um, well, okay, so people don’t know necessarily that they’ve got mould in the house because one, they might not smell it. If it’s small. It could be behind the bathroom tiles, couldn’t it?

Dr Peter Eng 31:48

Molly Knight 31:50
And they may not actually know Yeah. Here’s another little thing. Another question. How do you get a house test or public commercial building hall tested a hall okay.

Dr Peter Eng 32:06
Yeah. Oh, the home you could pay for it, you know landlords will deny is a problem because the money is money. Yeah. All these denials I call them

Molly Knight 32:22

Dr Peter Eng 32:27
Yeah, it’s shocking, isn’t it?

Molly Knight 32:30
It is actually. Um, yeah.

Dr Peter Eng 32:33
Especially snow. Just like with the tobacco. I remember some 30 years ago. Respiratory physician in Sydney say there’s no that the tobacco smoking does not cause lung cancer and with chest position. See that?

Molly Knight 32:52
Now that’s terrible, isn’t it? Yeah. Yeah. He’s another one. And this is I use a lot of eucalyptus. soil so Elaine has asked Can bleach or eucalyptus oil kill the mould and dead spores.

Dr Peter Eng 33:07
bleach is dangerous is a toxin. Don’t use it. Don’t okay. Yeah, but eucalyptus oil. I have no experience. Okay. Oh Ha this will not harm you. Use colloidal silver Yes.

Molly Knight 33:25
So could you Peter could you you know when you in the bathroom in around the tiles you often see bits of mould growing. Could you spray that with some Colloidal Silver would that work?

Dr Peter Eng 33:36
No, because the mould is behind the tiles as well, you’ve got to remediate.

Molly Knight 33:42
Okay, gosh, its a huge job.

Dr Peter Eng 33:47
Behind the bathroom. Yeah, this leaking. Yeah. Oh, yeah. costs a fortune. Huh?

Yeah, that’s a bit depressing Peter.

I spend $200,000 trying to remediate the house trying to get the new roof in all in the end as we put the case to the builder, yeah. When you to vicap yeah you got to pay for all this and reimburses immigrant coupon and in the end he paid us out

what back the house is a public company?

Molly Knight 34:23
Right. Okay. Yeah. And okay. So um, have you got the Colloidal Silver, can you show us how you use? Oh, silver?

Dr Peter Eng 34:36
Yes. So, this means

Molly Knight 34:39
you do in the recommend injecting it or is it just a nasal spray,

Dr Peter Eng 34:45
you just open in spread the nostril now, patients tend to point upwards but the nostril goes backwards. Okay.

Molly Knight 34:54

Dr Peter Eng 34:55
of the nose is getting towards the back of the nose, parallel to the roof of the mouth.

Molly Knight 35:00
Ah, okay, excellent. Yeah, yeah. Not up, across. Okay. Yeah, yeah.

Dr Peter Eng 35:10
Okay. No microyeahnes within a month. a month. Yeah.

Molly Knight 35:16
So if someone say they presented with really chronic sinusitis for instance, could they without doing all the tests, would it be helpful but they just use that Colloidal Silver nasal spray anyway? Or

Dr Peter Eng 35:34
finger b can be can do that yeah.

Molly Knight 35:38
He says you should. Sorry.

Dr Peter Eng 35:42
It doesn’t harm a patient.

Molly Knight 35:44
Yeah, yeah. Okay, lovely. Yeah. Yeah. Do it for a month a couple of times a day.

Dr Peter Eng 35:53
Two or three times a day, two squirts to each nostril. And today, the trouble you got to get the doctor to write the script.

Molly Knight 36:01
Ah, okay, so you can’t buy it over the counter

Dr Peter Eng 36:06
if I pass 1,000,002 50 parts per million with some EDT so that the Calypso will just will stay on the surface of the nostril. Yeah, and not come out through the way and this antibiotic again to Meissen.

Molly Knight 36:19
Ah, okay.

Dr Peter Eng 36:21
That’s supposed to be prescribed by a doctor.

Molly Knight 36:24
Okay, so could I pop down to my local GP and say I want a script for this because I’ve got sinus or something.

Dr Peter Eng 36:33
Absolutely. Look at you.

Molly Knight 36:36
I’m silly. Yeah. Okay, so um, So it’s not a particular brand of Colloidal Silver. It’s a prescription with gentamicin in it.

Dr Peter Eng 36:51
Chemist can do any compounding chemists.

Molly Knight 36:54
Okay, you compoundings. Yeah. Yeah.

Dr Peter Eng 36:59
Also compounded By chemists, compounding chemists Yeah.

Molly Knight 37:07
Yeah, we’ve got a few of them here in Sydney. Um, Kelly asks, Is there a die off effect from misting the Colloidal Silver make me die off effects You know how sometimes people go on like a Candida diet or take antifungal herbs and they get they feel horrible for a while.

Dr Peter Eng 37:28
But for most we recommend a ketogenic diet.

Molly Knight 37:32
Okay ketogenic

Dr Peter Eng 37:34
Yeah. And we lose three. This what Schumacher has died is about four patients suffering from sirs. That’s the one he recommends.

Unknown Speaker 37:42
Hmm keto Okay, good to know. Thank you. Yeah.

Dr Peter Eng 37:46
Thing Mediterranean and lots of organic salads and vegetables and fishes. Not tuna too much mercury but fish. Lots of with olive oil, and walnuts now if you ever hungry say walnuts don’t ever Get a kick.

Molly Knight 38:02
All the nice things Peter you take the fun out of life. Okay, great keto diet. Always get your walnuts. Good for the brain. Now Kathy has asked, Does the Colloidal Silver nose spray interact with heart medications?

Dr Peter Eng 38:25
No, no.

Molly Knight 38:28
Okay. All right. Okay, do you have any experience, Peter with citrus seed extract or grapefruit seed extract at all? Would that be useful?

Dr Peter Eng 38:42
No, not for mould.

Molly Knight 38:45
No, not for mould at all.

Dr Peter Eng 38:47
Yes, we’re grapefruit seed use of cancer treatment in my practice.

Molly Knight 38:51
Oh, okay. Okay. Okay, good to know. Good to know. I like Grapefruit seed extract. I think it’s quite powerful. Hmm. Okay, um, so that the blood tests um, we need to find a special doctor who’s trained with Dr. Schumacher. Hmm. Yes. And and we would, where would we find these doctors these GPS.

Dr Peter Eng 39:23
So you might have to Google integrity, integrity doctors perfect practicing integrity medicine, with the interest in a toxic illness board certified, having passed the exam and certified by Dr. Schumacher, as someone trained in his treatment protocols, okay.

Molly Knight 39:50
All right, all right. And once they do that, then they can get all the blood tests, they’ll know what you’re talking about here. And are these blood tests expensive Peter?

Dr Peter Eng 40:00
Yes. So to initially when my family they were sick five of them, just to have it tested for urine from mycotoxin. Cost $1,150. So, finally reduce it to seven $770 urine test. Yeah. From mould mycotoxin in urine. Yeah, then it so I can the cost expensive. You run into thousands of dollars certainly control. Yeah. So some doctors will say, Well, you can’t afford to have this test but clinically I’ve got an experience to say you got service. Yeah, yeah. So yes. House or your house is certified more free. You can take call restyle me. Yeah. And you can take Colloidal Silver. Yeah, yes, sir. Hello. And some patients miraculously come and say I’ve had this for months. Look at me. I’ve got no more fatigue. I can make this happen. You don’t mean anything?

Molly Knight 41:08
Yeah. Okay. Okay. So you can take these things and they won’t hurt you,

Dr Peter Eng 41:13
wouldn’t you? This is not just buying anything. Right. mycotoxins. Yeah, yeah,

Molly Knight 41:20
yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I think everybody probably needs something like that. Because I think we live in a very moldy environment really, and I don’t know what Melbournes, like, but Sydney’s very humid. And, yeah,

Dr Peter Eng 41:34
I went to school there in the winter to Australia, I came straight to Melbourne.

Molly Knight 41:41
Didn’t like Sydney. Peter what about. Shelley said, oil of cloves. Kill spores, doesn’t it?

Dr Peter Eng 41:54
I do not publish studies. Yeah. So don’t use

Molly Knight 42:00
Yeah, okay. Yep. All right. Um, let me have a look. Portia asked. Oh, okay, so someone’s asked, Can we post the main points of the video step by step on what to do on to our page so yeah, we can do that, can’t we?

Dr Peter Eng 42:22
Yeah, we can give you a plan.

Molly Knight 42:23
Yeah, can you? Are you okay to send me the questions? Can we put the questions you ask patients? Can we put them up on our page so people can see how many symptoms that they actually do have.

Dr Peter Eng 42:38
We’ve got this. This patient is called tick the box. Yeah, tick. tick the box. Yeah, this 37 most frequent symptoms seen in cases of CES water damage homes. It definitely, yeah, you be treated sick. almost certain. Certainly. Okay, okay. Then they have been good. The gene the nasty gene. Right.

Molly Knight 43:05
Okay. Okay, so what? what we can do? Sorry?

Dr Peter Eng 43:10
I can email the question that is tomorrow.

Molly Knight 43:13
Yeah, thank you. That’d be great Peter, and then what we can do for our viewers and members of the Health Australia Party, we could put up your information and how they contact doctors, I could have a look and we’ll see who are the doctors that they could go to around Australia. And and that way people could could, you know, start the healing process? Because I know, I mean, I’ve been in practice 37 years and probably, I reckon 90% of my patients have probably been mouldy.

Dr Peter Eng 43:51
Yeah, that’s right. Because mainstream can’t help them. It means to doctors, the drug peddlers, you got sore throat heres a script for antibiotic. There you go. Mine is my headache migraine tablet. There you go the joint pain. Here’s a script by Celebrex they’re drug peddlers

Molly Knight 44:12
okay yeah, well yeah, that’s pretty true. Actually. Jesse has just asked Oh, hang on. I’ve lost her. Where is it? Jesse has just asked is dry heat. Better than humidity for SIRs patients.

Dr Peter Eng 44:28
Oh, yes, but don’t be too dry skin gets too dry. Okay. Yeah. Humidity should be maybe not exceeding 50% Yeah. 30 to 50%. So humidity meter. Yeah. And it is very moist. The moisture is more than 50% there’s something wrong. Yeah. Okay. For example, double brick walls. Sometimes they don’t have this little space. Racing that lifts in and out. Yeah, yeah. into some event.

Molly Knight 45:04
Yeah, yeah. event. Yeah. Okay. Um, so and I know we I bought a little meter for $25 it was from jaycar. And it tells me how much humidities in my room. Yes. And yeah, and I like so if you’ve got too much humidity. Could you put a fan on or a heater on depending whether it’s summer or winter? Would that change the level of moisture in the air Peter?

Dr Peter Eng 45:34
I am not the expert in the area. ventilation but obviously, if it’s a hot dry day, you put the fan on the open the windows a bit. I am not the expert in there. Yeah,

Molly Knight 45:49
yeah. Yeah, fair enough. Okay. Um, Kelly asked. When you treat patients with mould instance, illness when you treat patients for mould. Can they feel worse for a while before starting to feel better? Do they feel rotten for a while and

Dr Peter Eng 46:08
They can. Yeah, this, the but as you clear the moulds, they will improve. You know, usually in a month they’ll say they’re better.

Molly Knight 46:19
Mm hmm. In a month. That’s quite staggering. Really? That’s very quick. Yes. That’s a deeper problem. Yeah.

Dr Peter Eng 46:28
And most of them two months. Yeah. But if it’s still there, you’re sick. The mean, so somewhere your home has got mould. Are you? Yeah.

Molly Knight 46:38
Okay. Okay. Um, Kim has asked, how can you treat fungal infections, and are they related to mould exposure as well. So fungal infections, maybe fungus on the body or an internal, like candida problem, I guess that I’m not sure what she means, but I’m just guessing the Yeah.

Dr Peter Eng 47:00
Oh, so you look at the fungal lesion on the skin. Yeah. Well, you can use a antifungal cream. Yeah.

Molly Knight 47:15

Dr Peter Eng 47:17
From the chemist shop, it comes to us apply the twice a day for month they should go. But I think some 50 years ago 40 years ago, we used to use selsun very smelly stuff, like a soap from the body from the neck down to the toes. And

Molly Knight 47:36
yeah, I remember that. Yeah. selsun but yeah. Old fashioned things. What about if someone has a constant like a recurrent candida problem like women have vaginal thrush or children have a lot of thrush in the mouth? Is that related to mould spore in the in the building

Dr Peter Eng 48:03
and that’s a good question. Not pumped. Patients can be there. You can use a drug called Sporenex to kill them, but I don’t have any herbal things I know of that can be used for vagina trash. Yeah. Do you need to use Canestan in one of those? Yeah, yeah. That is different from inhalation

Molly Knight 48:32
of Yes, yes. Yes. Yeah. treating the gut. Yeah. Okay. So, just to to have an overview. The symptoms are multi layered and cluster and almost any symptom you can think of from mental, emotional, physical. pool can be linked to mold and you may not even know that you’ve got mold around you. This room may not see it. Yeah,

but that’s a frightening thing you may not see. Yeah, that is frightening actually.

Dr Peter Eng 49:18
Pick it up. Sorry, the mycologist to come to me go receiving good receiving the go behind three just the go everywhere in the house and the test almost so they can test for see for dust for DNA testing for moth is a PCR testing for molds. Yeah. So the dust and if the most a monster does, the test will pick it up.

Molly Knight 49:46
It’s a piece of the ACR.

Yes, okay. All right.

Dr Peter Eng 49:53
Yeah. brighttalk told me if you’ve got skin, fungal lesions, which feels ointment With fields, yes, we use a time to kill the most and the skin instead of using an antifungal cream.

Molly Knight 50:07
Yeah. Okay, so another good golden oldie remedy

showing our age Peter.

Okay, so the first step is your questionnaire symptoms, what how many you’ve got? And I mean, I think probably things like the urine test and that would be out of people’s a lot of people’s range of being able to afford it, particularly these days anyway. So they could find one of these doctors and take the medications, the nasal spray and see how they go because that can’t get hurt

Dr Peter Eng 50:44
by it by the homeless move free.

Molly Knight 50:48
Yeah, yeah. So

check that out. It’s gotten that’s got to

be checked if you’ve got all those symptoms missing.

Dr Peter Eng 50:55
All right. Okay.

Molly Knight 50:57
Okay. So thank you. You’re sending All that stuff that we all the papers we can put on the page. Yeah. Okay. Thank you, Peter, thank you so much for your time and your information and your knowledge. Thank you. Good night. Good night.